that bs thing looks like what lua would look like if it had no coherent design

i think someone's gonna need some ointment after a burn like that

agree, I guess it is called "bs" for a reason :P

Hi!

lo

I want to install FreeBSD on a my X260 to get more familiar with it, since I use it on servers, adn am looking around for WMs/DEs, what's a good one for starters? I can do without a full DE, as long as I have volume / brightness control working

tl;dr WM that doesn't suck?

I'm browsing threads and screenshots and there's just so many of these

or maybe this way

what WM are y'all using?

KDE

Sos: there's an entire section in the handbook on how to install WMs and DEs.

debdrup, i know how to install them

just wondering what to choose

Volume control and brightness can (usually) be done via mixer(8) (audio/mixertui if you want a TUI) and backlight(8)

Sos: whichever one you like; I used to use xorg+i3 but switched to wayland+sway.

My workflow is a follows: I put each program on either a separate workspace (or a separate screen, if my laptop is docked), and don't really ever see anything else (no icons, background image, or anything).

I would preferably have something minimalistic

I don't know if it's possible to get much more minimalistic than wayland+sway, without abandoning all usability.

alright, i'll check it out, thanks!

freshports.org/wayland has a list of things (terminal emulators, notification daemons, browsers, launchers, et cetera ad nauseum) that'll work with wayland, if you choose to go that route

Title: FreshPorts -- wayland

thank you

i use wayland too, for some years. previously sway, now river. simply because too bored with sway

can you run X apps on wayland?

i think so, but i do not run any :)

o.0

angry_vincent: what do you run then?

i run terminal, browser and irc client, that's about it

i also made some changes to ports, so that can be built without X

firefox can be set to build for pure wayland ( i.e not even linking against X libraries )

same for emacs

there is still a problem ( upstream ) for qt-gui. but maybe it will be sorted in future

is there a way to get the default python3 from a script?

hi, i need your help

i have dell mini pc and i can;t boot any freebsd usb

i tried with devian and it works

i tried and dvd, memstick

both i386 and 64

have no idea what now

I want to ask. Does Bhyve's FreeBSD look the same as VMM's OpenBSD? I see that Bhyve uses the VMM module.

ok, i am trying to dd img file to usb

but 'gpart show' shows dd didn't do anything

how can I remove partitions from usb stick?

i am stupid

i did of=da0 :|

welp, Sos left - but Xwayland exists to let you run X apps on wayland

It seems that /etc/fstab tmpfs entry does not work. I reboot, do a `mount` and see `tmpfs on /tmp (tmpfs, local)`, `zroot/tmp on /tmp (zfs, local, noat..)` but it actually does NOT work in ram until I manually do `mount -t tmpfs tmpfs /tmp`. My fstab looks like: `tmpfs /tmp tmpfs rw,mode=777 0 0` What seems to be the problem?

it works for me

angry_vincent I am missing something for sure

tmpfs /tmp tmpfs rw,nosuid,mode=01777 0 0

when I do mount -t    and run `mount`, I see two entries of tmpfs on /tmp (tmpfs, local)

so add 'nosuid'?    and change mode=01777?

maybe you did not destroy zroot/tmp ?

angry_vincent i didn't. should I?

Yes

I see

because you can't have that simultaneously

zfs destroy zroot/tmp -r ?

can you help me write iso image to usb stick using dd?

not stop I get "end of device" error

maybe, -r not required as there are no children in zroot/tmp

for example 16GB USB, aout 3GB ISO - end of device

wikan, any other output from dd?

summary

how are you invoking dd?

dd if=IMAGE of=/dev/da0

no, how EXACTLY are you invoking dd?

the EXACT command line you used?

can you show the summary, and also the exact filesize of the ISO you are writing

dd if=FreeBSD-13.1-RELEASE-amd64-dvd1.iso of=/dev/da0

dd: /dev/da0: end of device

previously gpart destroy -F da0

i tried to use stick anyway ut

but pc restarts

what does gpart report about da0?

after gpart destroy ... did you recreate one?

da0 destroyed

i didn't

i didn't because I "restore" from dd i quess

is "end of device" error from dd?

yes

now i succefully wrote memstick img

have seen some bugs in bugzilla about hybrid iso updated recently; may be try with memstick image that is more suited for writing on a memstick?

(or may be you have one of those "fake" memsticks that report the size bigger than it really is? :D)

where can i learn how to use Partition Editor?

Got OS freeze after deletion of zroot/tmp. Are you still there?

now it works.

do I need to change fstab entry now?

I still have the old one and its working. Don't know if a change is needed and what effect it will make

I lost the chat also

angry_vincent ^

Letiute: just run mount /tmp

angry_vincent my `mount` command prints `tmpfs on /tmp (tmpfs, local)` already. Do I need to remount /tmp?

also, anything on zroot/var/tmp?

No, it is fine

ya, thought so.

need chant /etc/fstab?

I already have and its working but not like yours

can you repaste?

tmpfs /tmp tmpfs rw,nosuid,mode=01777 0 0

lost connection - is there a way to get the default python3 from a script?

angry_vincent mine is tmpfs /tmp tmpfs rw,mode=777 0 0

use awk on /etc/make.conf would probably work, but is there any better way?

angry_vincent how much 01777 vs 777 and nosuid matter?

Pro-tip. . . to add stuff to /etc/fstab, mount it manually how you like, then use 'mount -p' to get the /etc/fstab syntax right.

someone read the man page

Just been doing this shit since FreeBSD v3.0.

Letiute: i copied the line verbatim from FreeBSD wiki

Letiute: and yes, man fstab has an example for tmfs entry

tmpfs rather

angry_vincent link? I used similar but reslted different

angry_vincent thanks till herer though :thumbsup

I personally edit my fstabs by hand, and have never had an issue I couldn't fix - but it is error-prone and what CrtxReavr said is probably advisable.

Thing about "fixing" fstab, is it just might require console access. . .

Which, depending on the situation, could be very problematic.

Might involve a plane ride. . . or access to a virtual "cloud" console, which you may not have immediate rights to.

Or, could involve trying to rely on some knuckledragger in a datacenter, with sketchy language skills to be your eyes and hands, all while you shout at them over the roar of fans and air conditioning.

Three things to avoid breaking at all costs. . . your boot, your network connection, and your ssh access.

CrtxReavr, yip.

vi(m) is a great editor but telling someone how to navigate it over the phone. . . no thanks.

I have nano on all my systems, so I don't share your pain

(yes, I know it's gnu rubbish)

vi(m) is nice for being ubiquitous... what's wrong with GNU tho? A little militant with the GPL maybe, but are they ALL bad? O.o

please recommend one software to read epub file under FreeBSD.

calibre?

That, or fbreader.

hi this is the channel for live chat for GSoC Live

Nah this is the channel for FreeBSD :^)

there was a kiwi IRC link, i thought its for #freebsd here

nvm i will find it

its here

irc.geekshed.net

cool cool cool bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=270404

Title: 270404 – comsat is willing to try to read and display any file

should this be in tmpfs too?  zroot/var/tmp?

which directories get written most like /tmp is? better but them in tmpfs if the system has heavy activity so disk can be saved?

well I guess " Files and directories located in /var/tmp must not be deleted when the system is booted."

any other?

Letiute: no, i don't think it should

true

any other optimzation?

Letiute: if you're using ZFS, you want to leave RAM for ZFS ARC, so, no, you shouldn't put random stuff into tmpfs, unless you have a whole lot of it

I have plenty of ram

but drive is dying

if continues such writes

okay, but, what's a) what's your use case / workload? and b) if a piece of hardware is on the process of dying you should be looking to replace it

not shuffle chairs on the titanic

meena  300MiB/s, 70TB writes in 2 weeks

any drive will fail like this. workload: database, image files

"database", and "image files" sounds like two different workloads

true

a modern computer is basically just a series of caches, held together by different flavours of firmware and OS which often have competing ideas on how to keep these caches hot.

if the two workloads you're running are competing, you got a basic recipe for permanently flushed caches

which then causes more reads to disks that are very busy with writes already

meena: i just had a fun one.

50 LUNs of 1 TB each with a 64 queue depth, multiple 16Gbps HBAs, 3200 max IOs, having latency issues of up to 20 ms read latency during the backup window

fun!

all flash storage. turned out to be a san topology issue on one fabric

e/pi

Demosthenex: how long did it take to pin down, and how did you do it?

using dying hardware sure is a great starting point

meena: few months, san analysis, nmon data, latency tracking in the db, etc

backup ran at 3GB/s and the db server was doing 400MB/s always during that period

Any good vim /neovim like editor in freebsd? lunarvim seems to take care of all the lsp headaches but not in freebsd. ANyother *bsd guys use?

emacs.

and don't use LSP.

Letiute: What headaches? I use neovim with manually configured lsp:q

Demosthenex ok

dh well .. its just not automatic.. sometimes things get tough. e.g java

settings, env.

its not  a one liner install

lots of plugin

dh never tried lunarvim?

Demosthenex why no lsp?

Not that much of an hassle, but then this is what happens when you use rather opinionated monster configuration like lunarvim rather than writing your own configuration

I think I've tried lunarvim and chadwhatever, they just do way too much and not in very portable way.

Letiute: Anyway, take time to learn your tools, how to take them apart and put them back together, so you wouldn't be out of your depth when shit breaks

dh I see

dh have you tried remapping capslock with esc, left alt adn ctrl? I did that in linux but hard to do in freebsd

dh if you are a vim user, this would be either obvious for you or helpful

ok, `setxkbmap -layout 'us' -option caps:swapescape` did it for esc/caps. but looking for ctrl/alt

Letiute: No, I haven't had a need for such remappings

Letiute: firstup, why in the world would you want a whole web/rest stack on your localhost to answer editing requests? much less do you want your text editor network enabled and talking to things offsite

second, visual basic and M$ use LSP, and that's plenty of reason we shouldn't ever support it

so you move your left pinky all the way to esc each time changing vim modes? I just pres caps :)

Letiute: No, I don't use pinky. But I also use arrow keys for navigation rather than hjkl and I don't feel any need to adjust my behaviours

Demosthenex I see

dh ok

LSP is terrbile technology from MS that uses horrid javascript in it's stomach, it does feel like selling your soul to satan a bit, but it fucking works

Anyway, if it turns ugly, I can live without it too

dh Demosthenex ok but .. well you guys do not use code hinting, docs inline, goto definition? all that stuff that lsp provides

Looks like `man xkeyboard-config` don't have left alt to alft ctrl swap optoin

Letiute: those could be done outside of LSP, better.

i get all that in emacs without lsp

Letiute: I do use LSP

Demosthenex I see

dh ok

Demosthenex Is emacs that customizable as vim is?

dh I think you didn't found a better way than using LSP?

dh which lsp you use? LSPIntall?

iirc lspconfig

nvim-lspconfig

ok

And installed py39-pyright and stuff .. I mostly write python these days so, perhaps it's more difficult for some other languages, like Java .. but then again it's Java .. it's supposed to be painful

dh never tried emacs ?

I used emacs exclusively for almost a year a while back, to coincidentally to write Java .. somehow writing Java in emacs was better than in vim at that time, I've tried bunch of various programmers editors and IDE-s over time, ultimately vim beats them all (for me) and neovim has become even better than vim

Letiute: is emacs customizable?

surely you jest

emacs is the most customizable program ever

emacs isn't a text editor. it's a LISP machine

that can edit text

fantastic

Title: Vim Versus Emacs. Which Is Better? - YouTube

it's one of those things where the best thing is the one your hands remember best (without giving you arthritis or similar)