since when do irc networks use @ in their names?

nimaje: to mark ops

ridcully: that wouldn't be in the name *of* the irc network, my question was in response to ring0_starrs "since there is an irc network by that name too" to -hackers@

sorry, i misread

hi all

:)

hi all

x0x17: O.o you look suspicious

yeah

just has a busy day today

what about you badkat

cool, im smoking some meth while i fuzz some cloudflare crap

still using meth

?

stupid badkat

what is fuzz

fuzzing mean hacking badkat

?

just stay away from drug and smoke if grandma want

look, is the only way i can focus on this new crappy golang codebases

if the world comes back to C/C++ i will definitly drop meth

golang ?

haha

i see

golang ?

I prefer to just take the same exact, low dose of dexamphetamine every day for my adhd

haha i rather code in c / c++ rather then golang

whenever I take high doses of stims I just end up watching porn for 5 hours. but hey, whatever works for you :P

i never code in non-sacred languages

mtll: you are from the elite club that watches p0rn in freebsd? :D

my broda :)

:D

sorry disconnect

stay away from cigaratte and smoke and the rest

if you want ask your governor to sponsor you for placebo for research

I cut out cigarettes for vaping like 10 months ago now

don'tttttt

you will bleed

that's crazy

gonna quit the vaping soon too

i rather smoke rather then vaping

anyway since this is channel freebsd

come to channel #politic

for a chat

before Admin complain

nah vaping is definitely safer. most of the really scary stuff has since been attributed to badly designed vapes and e-juice with questionable chemicals in them

nono

you didn't know that is from chemical

not from tree

stay away to put chemical to your lung

well, cigarette smoking has a lot more chemicals in it :P

anyway, to me vaping is just nicotine replacement therapy that actually worked for me, unlike patches and gum and all the rest

gonna quit that do soon using varenicline, then I'm out

doesn't sound like much freebsd talk...

anyway, for core microarchitecture-based x86 cpus, coretemp.ko exposes its readings via dev.cpu.N.temperature. for allwinner SoCs, it's dev.aw_thermal.N.cpu

is there any utility that generalizes these readouts so that there's one consistent interface to getting the temperature?

mtll come hop in to #politic

admin already not allow us

#politic

oops

ring0_starr: i dont think so, AFAIK that is pretty much platform specific as in linux

but could be made like you say IMHO

Hi all. I installed FreeBSD 15.0 on an amd64 box on Thursday, May 1. I am using pkg for package management. The file /etc/pkg/FreeBSD.conf appropriately defaulted to the "current" branch. However, since that date, I have received only the message "Your packages are up to date." when trying to upgrade packages.

I have confirmed multiple upgrade candidates through the website. I have also tried using the alternative file /usr/local/etc/pkg/repos/FreeBSD.conf with no success. There must be something obvious I'm missing but I can't determine what it is. Any suggestions?

did you install anything via pkg? why do you expect those packages to have updates?

dutch: only modify /etc/pkg/FreeBSD.conf

/usr/local -> is meant for third party software only (packages)

badkat: yes, i backed it out after it had no effect, thanks.

no, use ucls override feature and override stuff from /etc/pkg/FreeBSD.conf in /usr/local/etc/pkg/repos/FreeBSD.conf (as pkg.conf(5) tell you too)

dutch: can you give us the result of "cat /etc/pkg/FreeBSD.conf|grep url" ?

url: "pkg+https://pkg.FreeBSD.org/${ABI}/latest"

ok then when you want to know if there is updates for a package you want, go to freshports.org and check the release table on the "latest" field

15-current builds are fairly intermittant, the last one was on april 27, so it's expected you have no updates

yes you should use 14.2-release to get the most updated stuff

nimaje: yes, I've installed many packages. I expect them to have updates because, e.g., I have vim-9.1.1265 installed but according to the website, 9.1.1362 is available.

why did you choose 15.0?

dutch: did you intend to install a development version instead of a release of freebsd?

nimaje: yes, I have newer hardware and my discrete graphics card and sound card required it.

ivy: ok, wasn't aware of that

dutch: are you sure that hardware wont work in 14.2?

yes

Thanks for the info everyone; i'll likely just play around with this system and build from ports. Thanks again, and have a nice day.

hi all

03:59 < badkat> /usr/local -> is meant for third party software only (packages)

I think "third party software only" is a bit imprecise.

/usr/local/ is the default prefix for ports/pkg managed software installs.

I would very strongly advise against installing things to /usr/local (or to the / or /usr/ prefixes) that you hand compiled, or wrote yourself (and didn't install from ports/pkg).

Personally, I use /usr/opt/ for such things.

You don't want ports/pkg knocking heads with non-ports/pkg things.

I just installed FreeBSD on my Raspberry Pi 3. I understand that the wifi does not work on it, but I believe it uses an SDIO bus. Is there a way to list devices on that bus?

CrtxReavr: yes i meant that (packages) that are ports ofc

badkat, but there's also been device drivers and other OS features that have been distributed as ports/pkg.

Dunno how long you've been using FreeBSD, but there used to be a crazy list of shit in the base OS.

gcc, bind, & perl come to mind.

X!

rip /usr/X11R6

I dont' think X was ever part of base, at least not prior to 3.0 when I got my feet wet.

The installer had options to install X and related packages. . . and yes, the default PREFIX for X11-related things was /usr/X11R6/

Fun idea - GenAI platform trained on all BSD code and documentation.

I'm reminded of when some guys tried to get a BSD-centric Slashdot-alike site going.

I mean, they did. . . even used Slashcode running on FreeBSD. . .

But it never took off as a thing.

it's all over now

farhan: FreeBSD is well-documented in comparison to GNU/Linux where it comes to stuff like `sysctl -d`. Linux has an abundance of undocumented tunables.

Who needs documentation when you have journalctl output? :3

who needs a computer when you throw the one with systemd into a lake?

farhan: someone may have done that or similar: papers.freebsd.org/2024/asiabsdcon/…the-FreeBSD-Expert-System-paper.pdf

not trained on the code though it seems

ohgod expert systems

anyway, this crazy paper claims modern expert systems are replacing experts with ML models. which is nonsense

this is a thing which died 30 years ago

truly, a garbage time of history

they will be laid off, all these supposed experts

FreeBSD garlic 14.2-RELEASE-p3 FreeBSD 14.2-RELEASE-p3 releng/14.2-n269524-1eb03b059e56 ARMIN amd64

doobdodoob

how do you like FreeBSD armin ?

mzar: I'm a long time user, I believe my first version was 4.x

OK

mzar: but it's nice yea, I like it

cool

I believe that its simplicity is un-matched, there's nothing even close that does *so* much with minimal effort

you nailed it, it's operating system best fitted for lazy people

duncan: i don't see anything in that paper about replacing real experts. it looks to me more like to assist users and admins in being more productive (less time spent resolving issues)

verbatim: "Modern expert system usually uses

machine learning to simulate the behavior of the domain experts." - whereas the original expert systems were computer systems taking advantage of expert knowledge, not simulating expertise

I've been fighting this battle for years across multiple companies -- write better error messages. :-(

the difference is a bit subtle, but they didn't bother even justifying ressurecting expert systems, which died decades ago

even at current $dayjob, we're trying to "find ways to reduce SRE toil" and it's like... we know exactly how to do that: reduce complexity, plan system design better, include SRE earlier in the process... but no, we're looking at AI

to be clear, the notion of modern expert systems is just weird. the name is still recognisable and seems to be an easy one to resurrect with all the money sloshing around. it died for a reason

100% agree duncan

it is a very, very strange bandwagon to try to jump on. it was notarious

notorious

half the reason it died was the cost of getting a decent capture of the knowlege. One *might* assume that the capture done in automated fashion will work better, cheaper...

the whole point was quality of knowledge, not volume. so, no

the other half is that large parts of what they were trying to capture were simply not covered by a deductive system

and that no volume of knowledge would remedy that (compared to the performance of an inductive rather than deductive system)

although, amusingly the same chutzpah driving it drove expert systems, so maybe this was all inevitable.

i guess we'd have to ask the author what he meant by "simulate", and if his intention corresponds to duncan's concept of expert system

overall i'd think there would be a lot to be gained from equipping automation with AI capabilities, to shift people's attention toward more meaningful/important problems (and away from highly automate-able work)

especially in a setting like freebsd where there appears to be a bonafide shortage of labor

freebsd project i mean

(or if not automation, then just something a bit beyond an advanced search engine, that seems to be closer to what that paper talks about)

this isn't a paper about expert systems, but a paper about information retrieval

onus is on the author to write clearly..

Hey, got a weird issue with bluetooth speakers and virtual_oss. When I run virtual_oss, no error occurs, speakers show connection for a split second and then back to no connection, I can hear no audio through them. Tried most of the stuff available on the web but to no avail

actually it's not a bluetooth speaker, but a stereo, but I think it should work the same. I can connect to it via bluetooth without problem, only that virtual_oss link seems to be dropped immediately. The program continues to run until I kill it, but no audio

if I connect other device to the stereo, it shows "BT", but with freebsd connection, it shows "BT" for a split second and back to "NO BT". The LED is not blinking until I kill the program though, and then starts blinking again