Hi

I installed some nerd fonts but still, I keep getting the squares in my terminalus

zyxer: how exactly did you install them?

Also, what's terminalus?

terminal

I uh... pkg install... I can't remember.

what Software?

How can I list packages I installed manually?

pkg noauto

thanks

ALso, even some manpages have the square

what's your locale set to?

nerd-fonts

is the package name

what is the locale var I shall echo?

locale C.UTF-8

LC_ALL is empty

zyxer: packages you installed are in the log

zyxer: my LC_ALL is empty

Locales help the terminal to select the font. But the font still needs to be selected which supports the characters.

what terminal are you using, zyxer ?

I wrote up my own notes on XTerm and mention with a "UTF-8, Unicode, Locales" section: proulx.com/~bob/doc/xterm-notes/xterm-notes.html

Title: XTerm Notes

That's from a GNU/Linux system but I think XTerm is the same on FreeBSD.

xterm is xterm

there are quite a few better ones than xterm, tho

is there a name for the info about how a program is executed? like all the args and stuff

and env vars

A name? As in, "command"?

well when we start a program, the env vars and command line args all contribute to the starting state of the program. so different starting state can cause the program to operate differently. what do you call that?

kinda like environment, but instead of for a user, it's for ONE running of a program

Instance?

what's the diff between executing a program, invoking it, running it?

loosely synonyms but what're the right words to use?

polyex: All the same, with the exception that "invoking" suggests the thing running the program.

The user environment is passed to programs and becomes the program environment. See environ(7) man page for that part.

what about invoking?

I usually call the args the programs option arguments. And I think that invoking, executing, running, and in some contexts calling all make sense.

I think executing a program may be the most Unixy way to describe it given that all of the calls to do so are exec() family calls. (Until the recent spawn calls which are new in the grand timeline.)

See execve(2) and the descriptions there for example.

rwp does "program environment" include command line args?

or just env vars

I see a little humor in that on 13-2R the man page for fork() describes _Fork() and says, "The _Fork() function appeared in FreeBSD 14.0."

The arguments share the space with the environment but are not actually part of it. So... No.

hi rwp

Hello nomia.

i tried your suggestion but it still doesn't do anything when i try to boot

i think that image doesn't have u-boot

but i can't mount the image in linux to look inside

I have never booted FreeBSD on a Banana Pi so I don't know. But I have written a lot of SD cards and USB storage. I can help with that side of things.

I do have a Banana Pi M1, the older model to your M3, and so I want to try it now. But just not a lot of free time to play with it yet.

(: u might need days and days to try like me

polyex left before I might mention that in the early days there was an obsolete way to call main() with argc, argv, and arge a pointer to the environment. So in the C program one could read args and the environment mostly the same way. But later the environment pointer was deprecated and instead global variables were used to access the environment.

Also I would mention that "getconf ARG_MAX" returns the stated size of the combined environment and arguments together. Which is the entire reason that the xargs utility exists, to avoid hitting that limit.

nomia, The BPi M3 looks pretty interesting. I have used the M1 for a lot of random things booting Debian on it. It would be pretty useful to me to figure out booting FreeBSD on it.

Life and time is what keeps everything from happening all at once.

Huh, something must be up with the Release Engineering, since the team just recently promoted someone as the new Lead

rtprio, I know other people like other terminal emulators. There are many. But so far I have yet to find a terminal emulator I like better than XTerm. The others are all worse.

kenrap: meh, i wouldn't worry too much about it. colin's quite excellent as well

"Many forms of terminal emulators have been tried, and will be tried in this world of sin and woe. No one pretends that xterm is perfect or all-wise. Indeed it has been said that xterm is the worst form of emulator, except for all those other forms that have been tried from time to time..." --With apologies to whomever said that before Churchill.

Re: Release Engineering team lead: It's probably simply time to share the load and put someone else in the hot seat for a while.

kevans: I see, good to know :)

it would be nice if freebsd had a free nntp server for discussion, might get tagged with spam though

jonusenet: the problem with every platform is moderation. that usually costs way more resources than the initial setup

good point, i had the craziest idea for freebsd

we can have a little distro for pure development as a group, like setup a fb15dev server and you can use nntp irc and web apps

and yeah, an admin can check the patches and we can have images of the os catered to the groups feelings

* check the patches every night and compile the kernel and userland, so everyone could use it. could give git a run for their money

otis: thank you !

rwp: releng lead seems like a thankless task

rafe: It probably is, but I still fail to see a point in delaying release notes while the mirrors have the images since more than a week.

armin: I agree this was bungled. There may very well be a good reason to delay but it has not been communicated at all.

rafe: exactly.

rafe: My naive understanding would still be to release both images and notes at the same time makes a bit more sense.

rafe: I don't see what the idea behind that is.

armin: I cannot speculate because I have zero information about the underlying issue, when they were discovered, etc.

rafe: I fail to see how the underlying issue is relevant, the release notes should have been written at the point of uploading the images.

The release notes are up. It's the announcement that's lacking

Sure we could nitpick this to eternity, but I don't believe having images downloadable for weeks while telling your users to not install these is bollocks.

s/don\'t//

I am not disagreeing with you

I will nitpick; however, it's been four days

rafe: not sure in what timezone you are, but 18-10 is "8" in my part of the universe: download.freebsd.org/releases/amd64/amd64/ISO-IMAGES/14.0

Title: Index of /releases/amd64/amd64/ISO-IMAGES/14.0/

i think gjb is tired, lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-stable/2023-November/001702.html

Title: Update to the Release Engineering Team Roster

it was supposed to be released on 14-10

it's now 18-10

rafe: Look at the timestamps.

*14-11

meena: I don't doubt it

armin: they were not posted on 10-11

armin: I can assure you of that as I was checking regularly

rafe: posted or built, these files obviously existed at that point.

rafe: So even if you rsync them and tell rsync to keep timestamps, this is still wonky.

good afternoon #freebsd , is FreeBSD 14.0 now finally out please?

Good afternoon, [diablo], no it still is not. It's still the "upcoming" release, even though the final images for 14.0 were built more than a week ago.

hi armin, yeah I've see the ISO is there

hence the question ...

so basically, I shouldn't treat this as the final /final/ release

[diablo]: I was just complaining about exactly this right before you asked, actually.

haha

a tad confusing I must say...

[diablo]: I fail to see a point in uploading images and then telling users to not use them.

yup

If it says "don't use" that means you should use it

Just to check why

I wonder when the official release will be then

I wonder when the release process will be adapted so that the delay between announcement and images will remain small enough to not confuse the majority of users.

(or images and announcement, even, in this case)

Anyhow, I expect some statement from the release manager once this is sorted out, there's probably a good reason which we don't know (yet). I hope this is being communicated more transparently in the future.

the whole development process in the git is open, too, you still would have the delay between the final commit for the release (even if not tagged) and the release announcement

Still a belter of an OS. Looking forward to it being finally out

BelterOS

hehe

armin a fine Dutch name you have there btw

[diablo]: Thank you so much, I'm born german, my grandparents were jewish, polish, italian and something 4th unknown. :)

[diablo]: I vibe with the dutch, though, one of my favourite countries, and they have, hands down, the best liquorice and cheese.

[diablo]: So yea I'm just that rainbow dog. :D

:D

lived in NL,DE,BE,UK and ES...

viva Europa

I actually loved Dublin the most, it was raining every single day (I love rain!), people are smoking and drinking beer upstairs in double-decker buses, record stores were just legendary, and the skater scene in the streets was really tangible.

Denmark was suuuuper nice, too, also Sweden. Never ever been to Belgium. :(

FOSDEM is pretty cool, I've only actually been once , but was cool

BRB...

have fun :D

when upgrading from stable/13 to stable/14 - are there any steps that differ from updating within the stable/13 branch?

jbo: do you mean in the command syntax or overall ?

mns_, overall

I assume I should also update the bootloader on the ESP? I never upgraded from stable/X to stable/Y before.

when going up a version it's much more important to do all the steps and in the right order

including doing etcupdate -p, installing the new kernel and rebooting before trying to install the world, etc.

I've not used stable and so not had to do a stable upgrade. I use release, and I usually follow the steps in the handbook and have not had an issue. I've gone from 10 -> 11 -> 12 -> 13

personally I do it by installing to a new image from scratch rather than going in-place

RhodiumToad, that would just be the normal workflow I also use to upgrade within the same stable branch, no?

jbo: yes, assuming you're following the documented workflow and not skipping steps

RhodiumToad, alright. so what about the loader on the ESP? does either buildworld or buildkernel build that and I copy it manually?

oh, right, you should do that yourself, yes

RhodiumToad, where do I "get it from" and during what stage of the process do I copy it to the ESP?

installworld will put it in /boot/loader.efi

it's not especially critical, older loaders have no problem with newer kernels afaik

RhodiumToad, so when I have my ESP mounted during installworld I'll be good?

I don't think installworld updates /boot/efi/...

ah, /boot/loader.efi is different ofc

I would update the efi after installworld and before rebooting

since that keeps loader.efi in sync with the rest of /boot

do I only update /boot/efi/efi/freebsd/loader.efi or also /boot/efi/efi/boot/bootx64.efi ?

if they're currently the same content, then update both.

they may be different if you're sharing disk with other OSes or have some boot manager setup.

yeah this is a dualboot with windows 10

bootx64.efi is the one that the firmware is supposed to boot by default, but EFI environment settings can override that

Is there a place in the freebsd handbook or documentation for simple user guides like: "creating windows bootable usb?". I would like to add such a guide because it would have been usefull for me earlier

"windows bootable usb"?

thank you for the info, RhodiumToad !

RhodiumToad, ...windows installation medium

what has windows got to do with freebsd?

nothing? But forum posts on this topic are still very active

and outdated most of the time

Title: How create bootable FreeBSD USB in windows for FreeBSD-12.0-CURRENT-i386-20171213-r326820-disc1 ? | The FreeBSD Forums

that's not creating a windows anything, that's using windows-based software to copy a freebsd image to usb

shit wrong link

Title: Solved - Creating a Windows 10 bootable USB-stick using FreeBSD | The FreeBSD Forums

one has to format it correctly then use 7-zip and then fusefs-ntfs which for a dumbass like me took a couple hours to figure out. Since I was always trying to mount the windows.iso like on linux.

certainly that's nothing that belongs anywhere near the handbook

ok then, so where should it be?

"mount the windows.iso like on linux"?

Check out step 8: kb.adamsdesk.com/operating_system/c…bootable_windows_10_usb_using_linux

Title: Create A Bootable Windows 10 USB Using Linux - Adamsdesk KB

ok, on freebsd you'd need a -t cd9660 option or whatever, but basically the same thing

and yes, fusefs-ntfs for the ntfs-3g package

only part there which is unclear is what the ms-sys tool is doing.

(and using gpart in place of fdisk, obviously)

oh, mounting from a file you'd use mdconfig first of course

or for that matter if you're just copying files out of an iso, you can use tar

(bsdtar can read everything that libarchive can read)

RhodiumToad, seems like upgrade from stable/13 to stable/14 worked well :)

good :-)

I guess no fun for me today :D

hahaha

you could update from stable/13 to say maybe openbsd or netbsd if you want fun ?

that does not sound like fun

RhodiumToad, that's where you are wrong

What you just said doesn't work

only unzipping and copying worked for me. The windows.iso isn't truly a cd9660 apparently

ms-sys you don't even need to use

That's why there should be a wiki page even for stupid stuff like this. Because if you are installing windows instead of freebsd you are probably already under a time constraint, where you just want to test some hardware support or idk.

and the last thing you want is to go on a 2 hour rabbit hole of "I read that there and there and there"

the arch wiki is a great example of understanding this

Arch wiki is so great that it helps me even with *BSDs at times. Since third party software isn't always well documented

And it can help 100% of linux users. My linux go to is Void, and it doesn't run systemD or have much in common with arch except being linux.

Perhaps there is a wiki for BSDs other than handbook? And other than forums?

As said the handbooks are great on all BSDs I tried. But at times I find some manpages lacking, or entirely missing

RhodiumToad, you still around, sir?

I feel like poudriere is ignoring per-port options in /usr/local/etc/poudriere.d/make.conf

in there I have: x11_polybar_UNSET = I3

that should unset the "I3" option of port x11/polybar right?

any reason why my history is gone when i reboot my laptop ? my shell is sh im using the default shell from the install

one possible reason would be multiple shells competing to save their own command history

Title: bash - How to change default shell in FreeBSD? - Server Fault

How can i get my chrome bookmarks to firefox even if i don't have chrome on any system i have ? on chrome for my android phone i have all the bookmarks

jb1277976, Which shell is it? Is a history file set?

parv don't know i'm just used to bash for so many years and tab completion

jb1277976: The "bookmarks manager" in your Chrome should have some way to export them as HTML.

jb1277976, What do this show in "sh" (I missed that earlier): "echo $HISTFILE ; echo $HISTSIZE" ?

jb1277976: and if you have that, you could just send a mail from your smartphone to yourself with that attached, and then later on import that on your computer into firefox (I believe???)

parv im already on bash no need anymore

jb1277976, Ok

jb1277976: Bit of a shot in the dark, but I reckon that MIGHT work at least. :)

Thanks

i use bash for user. ( not for root, there sh is set, unchaged ).

it's /usr/local/bin/zsh on my computer. :)

That too.

APROPOS locations on FreeBSD. Say I install a package or port, and that creates some /usr/local/etc/supercoolprogram - I got used to symlink these things to /etc/supercoolprogram, as well as symlinking /usr/local/etc/rc.d/supercoolprogram to /etc/rc.d/supercoolprogram - is it okay to do that?

armin, Yes. But why?

parv: just so I don't have to find out where it is, I already know before I type.

parv: "convenience" or "laziness" I believe?

parv: or let's just say OCD/ADHS? :)

armin, Be aware that "rc" system would start|stop supercoolprogram and that may fail due to order & some things not being available yet

parv: I'm not able to understand in detail what you wrote there. :(

*scratches head*

armin, See the manual page for "rcorder(8)"

parv: ty!

armin, Say "/usr/local" is on a different file system. During boot, "/etc/rc.d/supercoolprogram" will be used to start it; "/usr/local" not being yet mounted would cause that to fail.

parv: ah, AH!

parv: now I get where you're coming from, thanks!

... then mix in networking ...

parv: Yea thx for explaining that, makes sense.

yeah, i don't think i would do that

armin, You are welcome

I need to figure out if ripping firmware from an embedded device and disassembling it is an IP violation, or at least at what point it becomes an IP violation.

I know that if a protocol is spec'ed out via blackbox, then it's not a violation (a la Samba).

I just can't remember directly pulling the firmware and stepping through can be a violation per EULA. I thought there was a case a while back that dealt with that specifically, but I can't seem to find it. From what I can tell so far, it's not a violation to do it directly via firmware either.

I'm installing freebsd on a Chromebook with no sound that's just given. Will the headphones work ? I'm thinking It should or do those need drivers also?

I'm going to load the snd drivers regardless since this is a fresh install

hey there! I'm confused about the FreeBSD 14.0 situation; is it out yet, or delayed?

The announcement has been slightly delayed, due to minor issues, apparently.

veg, lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current/2023-November/004980.html

Title: [HEADS-UP] Quick update to 14.0-RELEASE schedule

thank you, rwp

are we talking about the announcement communique alone being delayed, as opposed to the software release?

or everything being postponed a few days?

Everything appears to be in place, generally, and many people have already upgraded to what has been marked 14.0-RELEASE (I have not yet), but the official announcement not having been made I would say it is not officially released yet. But must be 99.44% okay at least.

thank you for the clarification, for some reason I thought it was released, and was surprised to not see the website updated when looking for the release notes

I don't have any special view into things. I am just repeating information that has been published. But I presume there is some small snag that they want to make correct before they announce it. Otherwise they will announce it and then someone will hit that snag and it would be a complaint. A complaint that is avoided if they fix it beforehand.

Put yourself into the hot-seat of release engineering. It's a big deal to announce a release! And if it does not go perfect even after hours, days, weeks, months of work, then you feel bad that other people have complaints that it did not go perfectly.

absolutely!

this may sound like a dumb question but my synology just died and will NOT boot. I am looking at external hard drive enclosures, that will work through USB 3.. are there any considerations (minus usb 3 sucks) to worry about adding these to freebsd

I have not had good experiences with USB for full time storage enclosure use on any OS. Seems to me that after a month or two I always have to power cycle the USB device. (Meanwhile USB networking has been rock solid for me. Go figure!)

If possible eSATA is a much better choice for an enclosure. Or if you build Frankenstein's monsters just cable SATA cables out and around is much more reliable.

Also, I don't know why but it seems very difficult to find disk enclosures to buy at an affordable price. They just don't exist. I mostly use rack mount cases that I have refurbished with quieter fans for my own use.

i'm on a new system and need to get headphones working. but really trying to understand it. here is sndstat dpaste.org/k1bNh and here is sysctl -a |grep hda termbin.com/k0uq

Title: dpaste/k1bNh (Python)

following this guide is.gd/8sHTIM not exactly the same but im subsituting what i have

Title: FreeBSD – No sound on headphones – Muktadiur's Blog

so, I just installed 14-0-RELEASE

and freebsd-update install issues that after all's done, lol

WARNING: FreeBSD 14.0-RELEASE is approaching its End-of-Life date.

It is strongly recommended that you upgrade to a newer

release within the next 2 months.

I suppose they do need to iron a few things out :)

veg: Things move fast.

Lol it came out like two days ago though

>Get on FreeBSD

>New ISO

>Installed 1 week ago the newly released version

>Update

Greentext doesn't work on IRC.

>FreeBSD is out of date

I don't expect the text to turn green