ok. with that done, see if pkg install kdenlive has any conflicts (it shouldn't)

you may at some point want to do pkg lock gdal to make sure future pkg runs don't try and update it.

if it needs updating in future you'll want to do that via the port.

yes , kdenlive installed, working !   with usual no maintainer notices.

should I lock?

you should do pkg lock gdal

(and neovim if you want to, but that's probably less critical)

huh, freenode threw a wobbly on me

fantastic ! thanks. My last issue is installing brave browser but I do not want to be a support hog further. Just point me to the best way of doing it on freebsd and I will try to do it myself. Which way?

s/frenode/libera

I know nothing of this browser

brave is a linux based browser app

is there a port for it?

its a linux app (just like any other) which is not availabe in freebsd

ah. so you want to run it under the linux abi?

you could try installing the linux_base-c7 package, and making sure you have linux_enable="YES" in /etc/rc.conf

reboot with that, then the next step is figuring out what dependencies the linux binary has

(if possible, you want to start with a linux binary that's built for centos 7)

maybe use another browser in freebsd that blocks ads

why centos 7 and not ubuntu/deb

there's some stuff in the handbook iirc about figuring out dependencies for linux apps

centos 7 because there are packages for that

but ubuntu also has packages

why prefer cent

no, I mean there are freebsd packages for installing a centos 7 environment

oh ok

or ports, at least, I think they are available as packages too

linux_base-c7 is the minimal centos7 environment and there are tons of linux-c7-* libraries

I have a linux-only printer driver, and I make it work using this stuff

(hard to find a cheap laser printer otherwise)

RhodiumToad thank you!

RhodiumToad: define cheap.

I paid about 50 quid?

that was a good many years ago tho

2011, apparently

£45.80 including VAT

cheap enough that I wasn't too bothered about the possibility that I might not have been able to make it work

I'm curious if there are currently available <£100 laser printers that work well with freebsd

I'd guess refurb.

the one I have I bought new

I don't use it a great deal, but it's still working after 12 years and the toner costs have been quite small (unlike the costs of inkjet ink)

Laser printers are more "stable" than inkjets. Inkjets dry out when not in consistent use. Plus inkjet vendors are all predatory. Laser cartridges are dry and long term stable to sit and then always work when printing the first page after a year of not printing. That's my experience anyway.

this is exactly why I wanted a laser in the first place :-)

When shopping for any printer I will only look at network printers now. Those may or may not work with free printer drivers over ipp:// or not but if it requires a USB cable it will always be trouble.

mine is a USB

I bow to your zen nature. You are truly blessed if it has been no problem for you.

I wouldn't say "no" problem :-)

Book title: The Printer That Just Worked! And Other Fairy Tales.

One of my clients has a Brother laserjet with a USB and the only drivers for it were Ubuntu 16.04 32-bit binary. Note that 32-bits are no longer supported by Ubuntu in anything newer. And the driver itself requires 16.04 too.

when I first got it working, it needed a whole Linux copy of cups running in a jail, with a hack to get at the freebsd cups version of the usb backend

now I have it working with cups in freebsd and just the driver as a linux binary

Okay then! I bagged up an Ubuntu 16.04 32-bit system as a virtual machine and it drives the printer as a print spooler and everything else prints through it. Works. And could upgrade other systems around it.

however, the driver seems to have disappeared from the internet entirely

Don't ever lose your copy and the backup of it. At least not until your printer dies.

(at one point I considered submitting a port in case someone else had the printer, but without anywhere to download the driver from, there's no legal distribution channel)

Seems like you and I both basically did the same thing in order to drive the printers using closed source binaries in order to make it work. PITA!

Good morning

EHLO

250 OK

BYE TIMEOUT

How do I get "nc(1)", in a script, to print the URL returned after sending text to termbin.com:9999? (The URL is printed if just use "nc" on the CLI)

Damnit! In a short example, the URL is printed as expected😖

I need to stop bugzilla from autoccing me on every bug

Oh! I see there is no output to be sent to "nc", hence no printing of an URL!

Beladona: /usr/ports is typically the mount point for a pool, and so, non-removable.

rwp: can you (install and then) share output from lsblk?

grahamperrin ok

RhodiumToad, ironically Brave browser is available on macOS. I run Brave on my corporate MacBook at work.

Oh, and it is available for Windows too. So, someone just needs to care enough to port it to FreeBSD. Maybe Beladona will do that for us. :)

Would be cool if someone(s) would port Brave natively over to FreeBSD. It gets annoying when running it in a Linux jail and at random would crash.

It's also concerning when I see the linux jail throw warnings like this: linux: jid 0 pid 12313 (ThreadPoolForeg): unsupported TCP socket option TCP_INFO (11)

does Brave still have the bright orange icon in dark mode that you can't disable? that immediately killed it for me. project response was"wont fix, it's our brand".

markmcb: I'd say you're missing out on some really good web privacy benefits if you're letting the constrasting orange of their "shield logo" get in your way.

does anyone know the chat for enligtenement desktop ?

I am trying to install it in FreeBSd 14 - I wonder if is possible with wayland

I wonder if Wayland is yet a valid way to go.... I noticed even in Linux - some of the applcations such as Rustdesk still works on X11 --- and pulse - no pipewire

why going wayland if x11 works ?

This ^

AFAICS the value of Wayland is that it gives people tired of everything Just Working in Release something to complain is not yet working for them in Current.

"Don't have something to complain about and want to? Try Wayland!" :-)

:D

grahamperrin, I can't run lsblk on the system at this moment as all drives have been removed and I am copying drives one by one on a different system using ddrescue.

acu don't think we ever ported that

acu: I created the ML for e and worked on it and updated the wiki and a few other things , but they have no longer time release and there release cycle is weird so gave up

Spend the time updating it by the time it gets committed they create a new release

accelerat0r: cause the Linux world likes to change shit for no reason and make it more complicated than it needs to be

I think accelerat0r's point was that in FreeBSD if X11 is working then what's the motivation to install Wayland? Not asking why Wayland is happening on other operating systems.

grahamperrin, Also instead of the ports lsblk may I suggest "geom -t" instead? It's in base and always available. It has rather nice information output too. :-)

Though the xwayland was a wrapper lib ?

I am not running wayland so don't know but I thought it was the other way around. That wayland was primary and X was run as a wrapper under it somehow. When running wayland. (shrug)

Whatever runs xfce and Firefox

"pkg search xwayland" says "xwayland-22.1.8,1 X11 server as Wayland Client"

Does raid help with data integrity as well? e.g one drive gets corrupted, just due to raid, the system will know that there is a mismatch. But will the system know which drive's data is correct? and will it auto correct it?

With ZFS mirror, RAID-Z[123], yes; not with stripe-only configuration

kenrap: perhaps. but there are plenty of equally good alternatives that don't come with the eye of sauron.

Raid isn't a replacement for backups any ways

With a stripe pool config zfs will know if a block is corrupted but having only one copy of the data won't be able to correct it.

RAID is definitely NOT a replacement for backup!

There is still a time when 2 drives can fail , and there was a bug in the 3ware driver couple years back that corrupt the fs

So my 6 drive array needed to be redone

And that was a raid 60 which could handle 3 failed drives

parv the last message I got from you was "With ZFS mirror, ..."

parv but how will it know whihc drives data is correct?

does it happen in raid 5,6 as well?

cannot it be done with rsync instead?

Beladona, ZFS would ID the device, which may (not) be accompanied by messages from respective drivers

Beladona, Hold on ...

ok.

Read up on how raid works its similar to the z raids in zfs

I know how it works but not to the expert level

that would take many book reads

thats why here

cpet ya, zfs has slight different naming and internals

Beladona, First page search of "parity" at arstechnica.com/information-technol…tanding-zfs-storage-and-performance will give a shallow overview

Title: ZFS 101—Understanding ZFS storage and performance | Ars Technica

Doesn't really take a genius to reqs messages and replace the drive and let it rebuild

If you have a backup drove zfs will do it auto and you won't even notice it

Just make sure you have tons of rams zfs likes those

Feed me...

lets say there were 2 drives. how will it know which drives data is correct?

Read up on parity

cpet I am not talking about raid 5,6 here

just the mirror

Same principal it's copying data to two drives , and still saving meta data on both

OpenZFS Data Intgreity: openzfs.org/wiki/System_Administration#Data_Integrity

Title: System Administration - OpenZFS

cpet parv so with raid 5,6 it "will" and "can" correct data (wiith hlep of parity etc)?

Yes

Beladona, I do not know about non-ZFS RAID

Mirror is just a mirror

parv cpet ok with mirror, there is not parity. Mere meta data won't be enough to correct

to make corrective measrues

Doesn't need any it's copying the save data twice

So each drive is an extra copy of the other drive

And will still function ofnyy pull a disk out

ya, I mean "after" data is written. after a month, lets say one drive's part of data gets corrupted. How will the zfs know and get the correct data from the "ok" drive and write to defective one?

Ok your nuking this

Beladona, A (ZFS) mirror keeps 2 copies; a corrupt file would be replace with one from the other

how would it know the file is corrupted?

because it has checksums

It checks to make sure that both files are the same and will do it's thing if one fails , it does a full check or scrub I think weekly

Based on a cron script

jilles ok.

The z raids are more complex

Beladona, Have a go at publications/talks: openzfs.org/wiki/Publications

Title: Publications - OpenZFS

But pretty much work the same as normal raids

I want to make a big tank. (not the zfs tank. Just saying tank). and put all my data there. i won't have any other backups.  I know raid is not backup replacement. I do not need drives online all the time. The capacity is 12  tb total. I might order 4tb drives of 3 quanity. Not sure if I want mirror or raid 5,6. Want to be extendable. where I can

add things on top of capacity but I guess non will do that

With a mirror, you would have half the total capacity

Just buy 7 drives use one as spare and setup a z2 or z3

2 of those will be use sfornlarty and you'll have give or take 12 tv

tb

Beladona, Buy 10 TB ones instead in RAID-Z1?

I would go with the smaller ones quicker to rebuild

Note that around 80% of capacity of ZFS storage, performance drops

Raid isn't meant for speed

parv cpet ok.. I have to go with 4tb drives due to the price brand combo etc

Beladona, Ok

Buy different brands as the chances of failure will be random rather than the same

parv cpet what do you suggest?  mirror, raid 5 (3 drives of 4tb) or rsync based checksum and syncing

cpet ok

sane

That's on you

ya but whats better? pros /cons. I am confused

ease of maintenance

RAIDZ[23]

I have a raid 60 but it's not on zfs

... but would not work in your situation, Beladona

ok so whats fit for me

If you have to ask that then you shouldn't be using raid in the first place and chances are a raid 10 would work

why not raid 5

Mirror of 2-disk, 1 spare; or RAID-Z1

Drives won't be enough for the space you want

Raid 5 takes away 2 drives for parity and meta data

cpet raid 5 takes 1.  6 takes 3

So with those 3 drives you'll only have 4 tb give or take

cpet raid 5 takes 1.  6 takes 2

Either of

You'll get a speed increase with the 0's

50 vs 60 or whatever the equivalent is for z

checking

Probably a z3

cpet don't have that much drives for 50,60

Buy more

oh also, I have an existing 4tb drive and with data. so hard to wash it without haivng 4 drives in totay

Beladona, With RAID-Z1 (or RAID 5), only having 1 disk parity does not provide give enough of "ease of maintenance"

Damn I have a 500gb mirror and I'll never use those 500gb

the problem with zfs raid is that once its made, you cant change it

Wouldn't really call it zfs raid

parv am..t hen?

Depends how paranoid you are I have it setup to send me a system email when a disk fails really don't need more than that

And periodic has a script that scrubs the arrays however not sure that's healthy for a SSD

So I don't do it

Beladona, RAID-Z1 (replacing a disk by breaking a mirror is damn too fiddly; its only a consideration for me due limitation of cost & ports)

I guess writes are life eating for ssd. not reads. but not sure

parv isn't that normal. disk fails, you replace it in mirror

The raid 60 are using barricida drives and the fw deals with that

So you can litterily take a disk out and the array will be degraded and you just pop in a new one and it starts to rebuild

This is partly why I still use hw raid cards rather than zfs

I'm trying to join this channel from Matrix Element front end.. using their IRC bridge to Libera chat

cpet fw?

Firmware

I'm getting err_needreggednick error

can a mod/admin help

This isn't matrix help 101

Beladona, Actually yes, you are right

ok

Any ways my two cents

suppose I have 3 drives. 1 with data in it. Is there a way to build raidz1 of those 3 without invovling a 4th drive?

Could always just buy 2 10tb and do a mirror

costly

Cost of your data should supercede being cheap

But no the zx spec requires the amount of drives it requires can hack it to use less

@cpet.. I know.. but a slight hint would help.. if someone ran into similar issue before

just for better GUI I'm using Element instead of Konversation

SomeAB: why in the hell would I use a bridge when I can just load a irc client and connect ?

what GUI are you using @cpet?

Ircloud on the phone, cli most of the time

cpet ya but I only need 8tb

SomeAB, This channel requires registered users. If you are getting kicked at start it sounds like your Matrix nick is not registered. Just guessing here...

space

suppose I have 3 drives. 1 with data in it. Is there a way to build raidz1 of those 3 without invovling a 4th drive?

Zpool create raidz1 disk1 disk1 disk1

See if it works

Think I'm missing the name but

@rwp .. thanks.. yeah I'm trying to figure that out.. how to register my matrix id on IRC... so I can get past this error

I tried my luck in here, since someone might have run into a similar issue

I think if not registered then instead of here irc redirects one to another channel name, I forget. So if you find yourself in an irc channel but a different one then that is definitely an unregistered nick issue.

yeah its saying "You were removed from #freebsd by appservice,Reason: IRC error on #freebsd: err_needreggednick "

error is self explainitory

register then connect

yeah.. ok one last thing

whatever happened to freenode IRC?

I vaguely remember Freebsd having a channel on freenode.. I could be wrong

think souns bought it and refuse to keep it open so they made libera chat

or something to that extent i dont know never cared

Freenode was taken over in a hostile takeover and everyone sane left there to come here.

Moved here after Korean prince bought FreeNode & then things went to the shitter

Freenode is now abandoned. Nothing of value is there now. Everyone is either here on Libera.Chat or on OFTC or one of the other older IRC networks.

freenode wasn't owned by its maintainers which made the takeover possible. libera is supposed to be different in this respect

SomeAB, Reference wiki.freebsd.org/IRC/Channels for the current status.

Title: IRC/Channels - FreeBSD Wiki

Beladona, In "there a way to build raidz1 of those 3 without invovling a 4th drive", do you mean one of the disks is the one with the data? If so, no.

yes

I see

I remember the good old days of Rizon IRC

and using chatzilla

even the 13-15 year old me could understand and use it back then

@rwp.. that sounds interesting.. can you name a few popular channels on OFTC or where to find them

I remember the good old days of arisoft BBS chat i.imgur.com/4JzmNNw.png

and also, which old IRC Networks are still good enough to hang around?

efnet

atleast you can curse there ;/

SomeAB: ircnet, esper.net, efnet... but the channels i know are for niche interests

Yeah, some good times back then when it seemed that all channels and servers were flooded with users.

darkscience

you can still join BBS's but not many BSD ones

still fun to login too as most are older and know more

cpet: Yeah, I still play LORD (Legend of the Red Dragon) on one server.

most are games

but some offer some *nix communities

cpet: Know of any good ones?

bbs.alsgeeklab.com:2323

cant go retro if you login with ssh :P

would 250 GB drive enough for freebsd having postgres, desktop environment, browser, obs, kdenlive etc. (data be elsewhere)?

yes

ok

rbatty even 100g?

yes

personally i never go below 250GB on a system but even with 100GB i think youre safe as long as youre still storing outside the system

most of the applications you mentioned barely take up any space

ok.

rbatty how much usually the size grows to?

i think as long as your storing large files outside of the freebsd installation you wont even have to worry about that

pre desktop environment youre at like 1-2GB, with a desktop environment between 15-20gb

ok

can i have 10 drives of 4tb? of course with cable extensions

when it comes to external stroage on freebsd i have little knowledge, i run an ubuntu server in my house and my freebsd machine stores work on there. but i dont see why not? have you checked the docs?

ok

Beladona: yes

OS has no limit I think. its a hardware limit

yeap

I had a 3ware card with break out cables so up too 12 drives

my little mini Lenovo only has room for 2 drives and 1 NVE

my desktop has room for 6 drives and 2 NVE

depending on use case you could get awau with one of those synergy drive enclosures

so i upgraded to 13.2-RELEASE and as usual, virtualbox broke. the vbox kernel module in ports is compiled against 13.1 so it won't load. i'm trying to build vbox from ports... it's been compiling for probably 6 hours now

is there a 13.2 version in ports somewhere?

in pkg*

stuff from 13.1 should work in 13.2

so thats false

pkg update pkg upgrade

should fix your issue

# kldload vboxdrv

kldload: an error occurred while loading module vboxdrv. Please check dmesg(8) for more details.

KLD vboxdrv.ko: depends on kernel - not available or version mismatch

linker_load_file: /boot/modules/vboxdrv.ko - unsupported file type

why are you posting stuff withut a pastebin ?

like I said pkg update pkg upgrade

should fix that

it doesn't

time to check our ports and manually compile

however i find it hard to beleive it didnt update or reinstall everything after you upgraded to 13.2

i dont know, every time i upgrade freebsd releases i have the same problem with virtualbox

when you update the pkg conf shouldbe updated to use the new release simple pkg update and pkg upgrade should basically reinstall all pkgs and update

Message from virtualbox-ose-kmod-6.1.44 To avoid crashes due to kernel incompatibility, this module will only load on FreeBSD 13.1 kernels.

pkg site is "pkg+http://pkg.FreeBSD.org/${ABI}/latest"

tried also with release_2

jfc lol it was gcc12 that was taking forever to build

i installed it from pkg... now it wants to download a 4GB source for tex-dvipsk-2023.1

I've got a thinkpad t440p with a t450 trackpad. Cant get it to scroll with the trackpoint or touchpad. Any advice?

Is it ok to `geli detach /dev/da0` a running drive ?

running how? (in general, no)

its some sort of automatic reading somethign due to cron or so in system

how to plug it out?

RhodiumToad also did you got my private message?

I did, podcasts aren't really my thing

ok. no problem

I still insist but can't force of course :)

how to detach

fstat -f /path/to/mountpoint (as root) will list processes accessing a filesystem

a good trick to remember is that volumes with a lot of data and no programs should be mounted nosuid, this stops the daily security job from having to scan them

RhodiumToad ok killed. drive still spnning. how to  detach?

did you umount the filesystem?

no

so first umount, then detach?

yes

its a zpool.  named bd and mounted at /bd

oh

drive is /dev/da0

for zpools, you probably need to export it

it's a zpool of one drive?

yes

strange I killed process accessing it and its still spining

so what should be the steps

if you unmount it, does it complain that it is busy?

didn't tried. whats the best way to?

no need to export pool?

exporting will try and unmount it, so try zpool export poolname

doing, taking long, hdd keeps spinning

what does "fuser <mount_point>" return? any pids?

all commands just not working

taking long