hodapp: what's the topology?

rtprio: oh, I'd not realized that the issue was that ix0 was already on another bridge

turns out vm-bhyve has a 'manual switch' option too that lets you use an existing bridge rather than create a new one - so I just did that for the Bhyve VM

yeah

there are some options

just gutted my main server and put it back together, was a fun few hours. everything seems to be running a-ok

Hopefully you bought your main server dinner first. :-)

gluecode.net/blog/2026/02/14/gigabit_autoselect.html - As promised.

i hope i don’t get blocked from the bsd site for doing install after install :D

why would that be

“flooding” the servers

although i’m not really downloading the install THAT many times

ok so i ran the command “freebsd-update fetch install’

it sais “The following files will be updated as part of updating to 15.0 release p3…"

it listed a whole bunch of files

but its not doing anything

it didnt return me to the prompt, it also doesn’t appear to be installing anything. it just says “(END)”

am i doing something wrong?

oh is it just….. done?

hmm i just did it again and got the same result

what the…. i hit ‘q’ and now its going. i don’t understand what just happened

GoSox: you were in a pager (likely in less)

what does that mean?

it is a program that can 'page' through a large buffer of output, and apparently the man page does not have a good description of it.

GoSox: Press q

hmm i just installed xfce of whatever that one is called, but when i reboot, its not going in to it

oh there we go

What did you do

type startxcfe4

Sounds strange... what's happening when you boot your computer?

what do you mean?

.xinitrc exec startxfce4

Do you see a GUI when you boot your computer? Do you type 'startx' first? If you type 'startx' first, then what luna__ said is what you want, but you might also want a display manager, then you can choose different window managers. Anyway I suggest the handbook. It does a better job than IRC.

this is a clean install. i’m just sampling all of the available desktops. nothing happens when it boots, just the login command line prompt

startx opens… windows 2.0

Ah right, okay, then do what luna__ says

startxfce4 starts… that. and it looks decent

so when one desktop says it’s “lightweight” and another says it’s “full featured” or whatever, what is the actual difference?

startx starts Xorg and ~/.xinitrc if it exists, else /usr/local/etc/X11/xinit/xinitrc which starts twm and some xterm windows

would be good to install lightdm or such tough

Optimal setup is probably to start lightdm or similar at boot.

Without startx.

i agree

but now i’m just sampling

this isn’t the real machine

Fair enough

xfce4 is kinda nice, i like it

I'm too basic for that.

being “light weigt” i do wonder what features it lacks vs something liek KDE fusion which is up next

Give i3 a try

i definitely like xfce4 more than Cinnamon and CDE

I'm not sure I could get use to a floating window manager again, especially on a low res device.

But as long as there's workspaces maybe it's not an issue

xfce4 seems very usable as a desktop

hmmm it doesn’t have a column view though

do any of them have what is called Column View on macos?

Dunno

Probably

hmmmm, any ideas how to start kde after installing?

startx?

or trough login manager

You'll probably have to put something like "exec startkde" into your ~/.xinitrc file.

startkde doesn’t do anything

You might need to find out, try "which startkde" to find out, then use the full path in ~/.xinitrc so that startx knows where to look?

Sorry, typos

which startkde returns nothing

locate startkde also returns nothing

i’m begining to think startkde is not on my system

it might be startplasma, but that could also be the older command for it, I don't quite remember

startplasma also not found

I've seen where some Linux users have to use "startplasma-x11" instead of "startkde"

also make sure you are in the video group

maybe startplasma-wayland?

nope

is there a way to search using which or locate, with wildcards?

Oh yes, video group, good call: what happened if you try startx without any ~/.xinitrc file?

it starts up what i’m calling “windows 3.1"

its not that, but its something that looks like that

not sure what it is and i don’t know how to get out of it

that's probably cwm

being in the video group i don’t think is going to help me when i can’t figure out what the start command is

if you are in bash, you can try to type in "start" and then press tab to see all the other commands

If you weren't in the video group you wouldn't even get that far so it's a positive sign even if it doesn't feel like it.

Spunto, lucius: startx starts Xorg and ~/.xinitrc if it exists, else /usr/local/etc/X11/xinit/xinitrc which starts twm and some xterm windows

found startplasma-x11, “$DISPLAY not set"

.xintrc doesn’t exist

but i’m not trying to start it automatically, i’m just trying to start it period

nimaje: oh twm, yea I wasn't sure which one, but twm is a fork of cwm, no?

installed via desktop-installer if that means anything to anyone

GoSox: maybe try "dbus-run-session startplasma-x11"

startplasma-x11 probably only starts the x session part, not the x server part, so start it via startx or some display manager

Ah ok so make ~/.xinitrc which the line "exec startplasma-x11" and then try startx

Spunto: yea do that first

wait wrong ping

ok yup that did it

wow this looks weird

if a lot of stuff doesn't work it might be a dbus thing, cause I know it really relies on it

at first glance, i like xfce4 better, but i should give it some more glances before i decide

I haven't used KDE in years but I really liked it back then. I'm using xfce now but I do kinda miss some of the KDE stuff

what stuff, specifically?

they call xfce light weight and they call kde robust but no one ever gives specifics of what they mean

The only one that comes to mind right now is Kate. And I remember liking the built-in email and address stuff, although I couldn't tell you why now.

I just don't really like qt, but from what I know it's more used in industrial/commercial stuff, so maybe that's why people call it robust???

i don’t like how KDE doesn’t have menus really. and no files on the desktop. And more of a windows task bar than a mac-like dock

maybe i should mess around with some themes first though

Quick question, hopefully. I have a FreeBSD install that I haven't used in a while so it is currently at 14.0. If I wish to check out 15.0 do I need to do a full reinstall as best practice or can I upgrade directly from 14.0 -> 15.0?

14.0 to 15.0 isn't a crazy jump, I don't think it will be an issue

I'm trying to get the trackpad on an old MacBook to work properly. I don't want to hijack this place, can anybody suggest a good place to try for some advice?

so far i’m really not liking kde

Spunto: what year macbook?

i hate how none of these GUIs have network settings the way mac and even windows do

sorry about that GoSox — it's early 2013, it works with ums but it's pretty rudimentary and I haven't managed to get atp or wsp to do the job instead.

Hmm - This step is essential, as upgrading to 15.0-RELEASE without applying the FreeBSD-EN-25:18.freebsd-update errata update will result in an inoperative system!

That does make me wonder if FreeBSD has a graphical network manager; I've always just used /etc/rc.conf, but I can imagine that being really clunky if the system were installed on a laptop

I don't think I can install that errata update on 14.0

GoSox, that's fair. I haven't really ever liked kde, well version 2.x and 3.x were 'ok'

its surprisngly clunky for the one peopel have suggested the most (not here but on teh forum etc)

so far xfce4 is way better

if i can improve it with a theme, i’ll really be sold on xfce

too much configurability in kde, that it doesn't always work

i’m just concerned ill be missing out on….. something, for it being the “light weight” option

too many menus for every little detail

I thought xfce4 was a bit....not asthetic to put it nicely

I still like Enlightenment desktop

yikes this is wierd, i connect to my old server’s vpn and suddenly i can’t actually reach the server anymore when i do that

ohhh i might know why

i should use a 10.x.x.x vpn ip range on the new server

welp thats not good, i just set the username of my router two a random 32 character string i didn’t write down because it was complaining about the password for some reason, ugh

ooooohhhhh having a utility that remember that last 10 or 20 items you’ve “copied” is suuuuuuuuuuuper useful. Like insanely useful.

so my website whatsmyip dot org, currently hosted on macosx, will hopefully at some point in the future, become hosted on freebsd

so thats something

xfce has some classic mac themes! that just might be what seals the deal!

i have much to do, another day

good day all

rwp, re: squeeze> thanks!

good day #freebsd

!inspire

Try not to become a man of success, but rather try to become a man of value. -Albert Einstein [zenquotes.io]

zerotime: Success is more of a function of consistent common sense than of genius. ---An Wang

When upgrading, does the `freebsd-update upgrade -r xx.y-RELEASE` process allow me to skip to the latest patch?

or do I need to install each patch in order?

!ztquote

Your time is limited, so don't waste it living someone else's life. -Steve Jobs [zerotime collection]

the best tested path is to update to the latest patch release first, but it should work without (except for the patches fixing bugs in freebsd-update)

also, when your doctor tells you you have a rare form of cancer that is operable, don’t sit around putting of surgery for a year while you try to cure cancer with 11 herbs and spices. take the fucking surger —steve job’s chost, probably

nimaje: thanks

!ztquote

The two most important days in your life are the day you are born and the day you find out why. -Mark Twain [zerotime collection]

by why did he mean how? like is that a learning about sex reference?

you should also be able to skip whole major releases, but I guess that is tested really rarely by anyone

that's interesting. does freebsd-update handle the patches cumulatively?

bugs.freebsd.org gives Error 503 Backend fetch failed

f451, seems good here, probably restarted

daemon: working now @2006 UTC

Re: HTTP 503 errors: Every web site for every project is getting attacked by AI Scraper bots continuously. It overwhelms sites. That often results in 503 errors due to the way servers and backends interoperate.

Trying to keep websites online used to be trivial and now it feels like a full time job just to fight the AI Scraper bots which stupidly grind sites until they are offline.

who can even tell them apart anymore

rwp, analysin the User-Agent: line does not help anymore?

rwp, How hard is it to deploy Nephenthes and iocaine?

:-1s/and/or/

ant-x: about everyone is lying about their user agent, looking at that has never helped, at most it created problems

And on the other hand, you don't want to budern your visitors with entering captchas &c.

I didn't test that myself, but most of those ai scrapers are really dumb, so requiring some cookie and having a refreshpage with a poisoned path as first link like in owl.is/blogg/blocking-crawlers-without-javascript should work fine (their goal is to get as much as possible, so they want to do very little work per page)

^ Why not simply block whoever request a URL disabled in robots.txt?

Is anybody keeping blacklists of those prose launderers (like e-mail blacklists)?

*blocklists. And probably yeah. They're a popular past time.

pastime?

and of you guys running your own mail server on freebsd?

any?

any*

This is starting to look like a variant of C.

I have no personal mail server, but over on ThunderIRC they teach how to host one's own mail with OpenBSD...

I don't (and have no plans to, based on what I've heard). But this book is highly recommended: amazon.com/Run-Your-Mail-Server-Mastery/dp/1642350796

users[ant]->leet_info.uses_own_mail==false

o0x1eef, I've heard it only sounds near impossible, but in fact is doable.

Yeah, I heard the same, I just have enough problems in life

Suddenly, there are no books about hosting one's own IRC or Usenet server...

That's easy peasy (IRC server anyway)

I think it's the big players and spammers that make e-mail hosting so hard.

Yep