megaTherion: you said mmap isn't my issue but others looked info subject much more deeply that i ever can and found that mmapping a file from zfs could lead to wasted memory

which would be "fun"

that would manifest itself much more quickly if you don't have much to waste

Ay

ketas: mapping a file from vfs is actually allowed and a feature

and that you let your system starve for memory is your decision, not those of others

there the question wasn't what's available but more like is it reasonably used... as far as i know mmap function allows one to use file as it were memory, it doesn't mean stick it all into ram immediately for fast access and kill sshd off

no?

*lol*

unsure what zfs does in order to do the same

dude please get that freakin more 4GB RAM and be done with it :)

you are wasting days on a problem which isnt a problem but a totally expected situation

maybe it could be fixed without harm?

Cloud VPS, 8GB RAM 4,99 EUR XD

this has affected machines with more than 4g ram

no for software you need RAM, for even more complex software you need even more RAM

previously it was, if you want it faster, add more ram?

if your system is swapping and OOM then it's not about speed but about working correctly

but what if it's not swapping

and still going oom

then its not

what then

so why not get more RAM? I really dont understand the issue

whats keeping you from adding more than 2GB RAM?

might as well change entire machine then, really

thats fine too

or change the FS, also possible :)

UFS is still a thing

but that's not real answer

you didnt ask a real question

yeah people tried ufs, worked

OS' behave differently if they are OOM, its a design question but I bet almost all have an OOM killer which then goes for hunt

if you want to know the details read the sourcecode

it's not because of mmap, its an side effect - the OS has no other choice

it's fine to use entire free ram for caching purposes, it makes everything blazing fast

well it has choice to not do it?

that doesn't affect anyone with 3t ram

you dont need 3TB RAM, 8GB is totally fine ... how much you actually need depends on the zpool layout and if its about zraid etc.

it cannot not do it, it's the job of the OS to hand out memory if applications demand it

well it can say no'

?

no it cant

read about operating system design and those principals

the actual situation depends how it arises, but if its inside the kernel then it must kill other software in userland

if you try to alloc some huge amount of RAM in a single program then of course that program may be killed or denied the request

but then in the end... what good is an OS which has no memory at hand

if its about user restriction then yes you can restrict those limits in FreeBSD

it can decide that now zfs works slower because there's no memory left

well it's not a program

it would swap then

hmm

well then maybe investigate how Solaris or OpenSolaris descendents behave, thats where ZFS is coming from in the first place

how they do it?

it's too complex too

I dont know, I never read the source code

maybe Solaris can handle an less RAM situation better - who knows

would be fun if this is valid bug when using mmap and with lot of small files and with low ram and with zfs and with slow io

like perfecf storm or so

its no valid bug

the person XYZ coding C and using mmap has zero control about the file system which is used

there is no relation

it's a trigger?

well who knows

its a totally normal function, almost every, if not every OS has it. Not sure how it's called on Windows but on Mac OS you also have an mmap

its just totally nrmal

+o

is there something in dmesg if the problem appears?

s/if/when

i don't think there was

as in...?

io error? :)

no about oom

only the fact that things were killed now

i wonder if tuning oom features would change anything

or not

because what needs memory is kernel

it was worse before actually i recall

maybe vm.overcommit changes something for you, dont know

unsure if it made zfs worse now

i hope not

there are also other ways kernel can take memory

should it always say yes?

maybe you want to read tuning(7)

maybe thay manpage needs augmented :p

to be

really never had a lot of issues, my NAS has 16GB with a zraid1... what always helps is limiting the ARC to a sane level

but I have other machines though non of them has less than 8GB with ZFS

nowadays it's doing it for you i read

the sane arc

can be... yeah

0.6*ram iirc

zfs actually works in 512m too :p

it was even unexpectedly fast

as long as there is no load.. sure

it started falling over due hw faults

dead now

lost half the disk too due i was lazy and didn't add 2nd disk nor did regular backups

which is another problem

well I usually always have zraid's except for some single VPS instances where I use zrepl to replicate my stuff over wireguard

yeah now it's fixed

damn git is too good stress test tool eh

:p

well it does read and write million small files and likes them cached as well for speed?

never ran into the issue, I guess you can also use rsync as replacement?

I'd expect that those programs have kind of similar behaviour

they do not

that's the surprise

using rsync to sync over terabytes will not do it

well you could get a systrace from it, then you can compare

far past what recommend ram can do... yet no failures

oh that seems like meh hard

what to even look for?

FreeBSD has truss and friends

well you said mmap was evil, so maybe rsync doesn't do mmap?

at least you'd see how it looks when both applications "copy" files

it probably has no reason to do so?

but i don't know

or you can read the soure code of course

or it has or it does

+c

right now git has

[core] packedGitWindowSize = 8m packedGitLimit = 32m preloadIndex = false [diff] ren

ameLimit = 100

meh forgot the split

but anyway

this "fixes" it

it didn't go deeead slow either

rsync doesn't mmap

btw whole issue started when there was huge change at once happening in ports tree, which is massive repo for what i usually use

openrsync does and we've had some problems with that, but we've mostly managed to 'fix' it

what is the 'fix' for this?

dovecot nearly does it as well... that thing also has legit reason for this

hmm

using dovecot too

also, abnormally large for machine maybe... tho dovecot did it whenmi tried to tune it upwards

I guess from the context it sounds like mmap is being accused of eating a bunch of memory, but that's not really how that works

index related values there were 128m...256m which i probably wrongfully assumed to not do anything bad because it's small on disk or in ram

mmap helps to eat it up?

not any more than usual, really

you can mmap a file but you still have to fault in pages/blocks/etc, it's not really common to prefault everything in

I mean, yeah, there's some trade-off there, but the odds of it being whatever anomaly your observing aren't really likely

what's the actual issue here i wonder

you're

:p

anomaly-ketas

it's only 21:18, I shouldn't really be oops'ing yet

run git without those limits, wait until git actually starts doing that particular unknown activity, hopefully you had top open somewhere before, observe wired memory shooting quickly in few seconds to 94% of ram, probably went past it... end result is no userland, kernel works just fine after it, you just only have limited ways to interact with it, like ping or keyboard

how do i know what happened

:/

what release/branch is this?

zfs default arc max is something like all but 1GB of RAM, but it should be responsive to pressure to relieve some of that if the system needs it

how much ram are we talking total?

limiting ARC is always a good idea

13, it started 13.2 or so, now 13.4 still seems to have other similar issues... maybe it's fixed in 14 or current, do you know?

and ram is 4g

while i have tried to use zfs with 512m, wasn't kernel panic festival at all

i even tried to look any offending openzfs bugs but that thing is huuuge and i don't even know what to look

not zfs issue at all?

having not enough ram is no bug ;)

well it rather sounds like perfect storm than tiny ram

and was observed elsewhere

funnily i tried to allocate ton of ram, tried some file tests, including mmap, increasing limits slowly so i could still observe it, i couldn't find anything, even arc and whatever else was in wired was scaled down and only test that ended up in actual failure was when just trying to consume ram, and what was killed was just tester itself

can't figure out smarter tests

if it wouldn't hide it, i could run some tests in small vm or so, easier and safer

Hello folks, im having a demential issue maybe you can help me to get out of it :)

after upgrading from 14.1 to 14.2-p3 my FreeBSD desktop (zfs) is going total unusable after 1 day of uptime or so

this system is always on, i had 122 days uptime before upgrade to 14.2, never had a problem like this on FreeBSD desktops so i suspect its a ZFS kernel module problem someway

in brief: after +/- 20hs of using the system the desktop starts freezing every time you do something

first thing i checked up was my NVMe, used nvme tools from base userland, S.M.A.R.T, etc the disk is in perfect conditions also ran the NVMe RW testing commands, seems neat.

also, when the system starts to get UNUSABLE i just reboot it and everything goes just fine, so I/O problem discarded

can anybody guide me to debug the HANGS/FREEZING on the kernel/openzfs.ko? thanks in advance :D

i think its ZFS related because, my ARC is the same as always (1G) i dont even need to do any heavy R/W to reach unusable state, just happens after 1 day of uptime more or less

how did you diagnose the issue to zfs problem?

rtprio: i need help to discard ZFS, but i think it is because the only thing that would change along time is the ZFS ARC CACHE, thats my guess

badkat: well, use bectl to boot back to 14.1 and confirm that it stays stable or still freezes

kernel memory is not exhausted neither, i mean there is 20G free memmory why would be hang like that

rtprio: i did that, the same day that i concluded it was not the NVMe

14.1 goes ok

i would love to try to report the bug, maybe contribute something to fix it :D

fun part is that when freezing starts, audio keeps going like nothing

so kernel works well still

how does it freeze, again?

also where the audio comes from

ketas: for example, you are playing music in background while coding in your IDE, reading articles on firefox or just operating some server over SSH. I call it "freeze" when suddenly i just can keep hearing the audio from the browser or VLC player but cant do nothing more.

not even change to other TTY

just xorg thing or more?

ketas: thats the tricky part for me, not sure what originates this..

can't ssh into that from elsewhere?

ketas: i restarted xorg some day to see if it was related to some QT library/AMD gpu driver and it was doing the same

and?

was there a change

no

or fresh xorg still choke up from time to time

thats why i think on ZFS ARC is corrupted or something i dont know

hmm

what about no x

you were able to kill it

same issues in console?

ketas: yes, freeze lasts less but still hangs weirdly the commands

hmm

if i navigate folders, or open files while thats happening it doesnt show any I/O problem

open top -qaHSPs1 and systat -v 1 and so there if not tried them

hmm

the freeze effect is random but not constant, it just evolves to UNUSABLE, day 3 of uptime is totally messed up

ok

would be fun to watch it evolve

i tried iostat

maybe over ssh

and when freeze starts the iostat doesnt even log that moment

if it finally locks up

maybe it's not io

nice idea with ssh, i could try that this weekend, i work in that setup so i restarted each morning XD

so finally... what happens?

freezes?

just becomes unusable, but keeps responding after the hangs from 10sec to 2minutes

hmm

crazy

wanna see that top during this

ok i will try it, thanks for the suggestion

and what happens after a pause

or before

maybe tail -F some log too

i did, nothing in /var/log

well did it freeze yet?

if it doesn't show up in any of those 3 places

it's weird

maybe i dont have ZFS debug messages enabled in the right way

all need separate window too since frozen system won't be able to do tmux window change

its working fine now, i just restarted like 1 hour before i did came here

i have time till monday to debug it

zpool iostat -v 1 & zpool status -svv for zfs

i will try to make some big R/W to see if i can make it freeze again

ok i will add those too

for interesting things to look of

rw does it?

and this was some flash?

ketas: not sure what does it

single nvme one?

yes, Samsung EVO NVMe

yeah kind of hard

to find cause

i have no mortality signs on the drive

ketas: thanks for `zpool iostat` thats way better than plain iostat

also, with -svv switch i see this: "Some supported and requested features are not enabled on the pool."

and recommends to run `zpool upgrade`, i have this zfs pool from 2023 IIRC

that upgrade could be risky?

maybe pool is from pre v5000 + flags time

or

hmm

upgrade wasn't needed anymore iirc?

or it was different upgrade

i checked the zfs logs

its from 13.1

v5000 is much older

but i'm not sure, it still might use manual upgrades

betas!

er ketas

just i haven't see it yet

upgrade would be safe if you don't go back

unsure if you could

also, freezes came after 14.1->14.2?!

you can leave the zpool as old now i guess

cpet is back

ketas: exactly, i had 120+ days uptime, then i said "Oh new release, lets upgrade" :P

uptimes are useless now

any service that has an uptime of more than 60 days you question it

perfect reason to test upgrades before using

just like I question my firewall with an uptime of 48 days

cpet: lmao i dont turn my computers off xD

it could be specific stupid bug

I don't either

whatever reasoned

but I like to be updated

and if that requires n reboot

then so be it

betas can wait

er ketas

could it be the applications..

?

betas can wait!

well there is an IDE, firefox, vlc player

betas the ketas

which ide, also?

no software would require a reboot

and firefox is one stupid hog

cpet: well i always try to update asap, thats why i did 14.1 -> 14.2 not 11.0 :P

only a kernel update

anyway wait until

freezes

then test

ketas: we need firefox

i would wait to see if it happens again.. and just monitor the apps

cause that other browser hasn't been updated in years

what was it called netsurf ?

maybe leave sshs open with all above commands

zpool status via topless or so

have it mail you if the app dies

"yo foo your app crashes here is the core dump"

well firefox is only way yes

pretty much

I use safari

my android phones do ff too

the only reason why I don't update is Firefox is just as bad :P

the issue with updating zfs is the possibility of the system not booting after update due to forgetting to reinstall the boot stuffs

so I have never bothered to upgrade

pool you meant?

yes i guess it's fine

either of you still need to reinstall the boot code

and that has a possibility of having a 50/50 you can reboot

where does the bootcode go?

heaven

or you mean updated one?

I have always updated the boot code after any updates with zfs

now is that good practice who knows but that's what I do

voy4g3r2: could be, i wonder if something that goes through the ARC cache corrupts it,dont know if that could be even feasible, just thinking in the air..

unsure if it can corrupt

machine did pass at least one full memtest86+ run, right?

anything can corrupt something

and buildworld

maybe

as a good measure

yeah.. well the whole corrupt thing.. is drawing at straws.

honestly if it can do a make build world without a core dump its good enough

does the freebsd logs say anything?

ketas: i did memtest yes, stick is fine

freebsd-version fetch install ones that is

meatiest is not a really good way to test

er memtest

meatiest!

betas a beer a day keeps the docker away

hah

for now on betas is betas

wtf

now that made me giggle

voy4g3r2: no, im sure i can improve the logs tho, preparing now for the shitty moment

you didn't mean docker?

docker is evil

any mention of it you'll become one of the ketas

voy4g3r2: what exactly is the issue

if you want to retell the story while I drink Guinness

would be appreciated

cpet: no issue.. helping badkat

beer world records

badkat: what is the issues ?

i am over here.. just doing a poudriere run, updating my mac with brew upgrade and doing some python code.. all good

I can't sleep

cpet: he has machine running xorg freezing up for 10s...2m

after a day or so

which one

exactly, thanks ketas

after 14.1->14.2

voy4g3r2: or badkat

has zfs on nvme

that's all

which video card brand ?

it's stupid bug

cpet: AMD GPU (Renoir)

model?

so, it did continue to happen after xorg was killed off?

cpet: Ryzen 7 PRO 4750U

badkat: how long have you used a BSD ?

cpet: 7 years

started in 10.2 or so with my servers

ok so you know you'll always have issues with the latest swizzle right ?

moved to desktop 4-5 years ago

23y here

never had this kind of problems

I have been using *BSD for 30 yrs

i miss solaris zfs

I miss opensolaris

you can hug illumos lmao

hug openzfs

that's old

ketas: im trying xD

have you recompiled xorg+ with debug

and use all the debugging system to help you debug why it crashes ?

don't try to hold openzfs down with hug

:p

cpet: i have this weekend to try that kind of troubleshooting

is this the onboard GPU r ext ?

2025-04-26 04:04:54 < ketas> same issues in console?

2025-04-26 04:05:38 < badkat> ketas: yes, freeze lasts less but still hangs weirdly the commands

im building the kernel now and checking for debug options

doesn't this absolve X of guilt?

well you can wait for fail before

or does it start in X and then continue

have you tried current

my desktop that runs current is 2020

cpet: onboard GPU

so in computer terms old

i have one armv7 current machine here

could do more

I was unhappy when rasp pi 5 has such shitty support all over

i have similarly stupid bug here

so I sold my rasp pi 5

how much did you get

rpi are not good SBC's for freebsd IMHO

badkat: how come you haven't invested in a AMD vid card ?

rasp pi 3 worked like a champ

er 4

onboard is fine

which one bte

btw

intel?

cpet: its a laptop, i have another setup with nvidia cluster over bhyve :)

I have a AMD ext card

ok its a laptop pfft

give up nd move on

laptops have so much software bullshit

it being laptop could also give fancy other bugs

perhaps cpu scaling

i have like 3-4 workstations here, i wont give up sorry

ok I can annoy betas then

betas

ketas: i know this setup pretty well, never had a problem, only this crap

why does this auto change ketas to betas

unsure what you do there

badkat: did it work fine in 14.1 ?

b and k are far away

cpet: Perfectly.

how keen are you with git ?

regressions suck

freebsd changed the way they do arm

what about git

they changed the way they de drm

did we switch topic

its a port

so I really doubt its a OS thing rather a port thing

you could backport to a later port

and see if it fixes your issue

again i have alwys seen these issues with modern HW

which machine too, btw?

new laptop?

users buying a moderm top of the libe x y and then having it have shit performace

is pretty much how it goes with FOSS

new anything really

i see some "allan" here, any chance is allan jude over here?

i've seen

you can email him

it's him

here

!!!

i will try to DM him and keep my debug mission :P, thanks ketas for your time

and cpet for the non-sense road leading questions!

:)

pfft f i ever help you again

;/

stfu and drink beer

doesn't it make you weird :p

kind of warm fuzzy

kinky

badkat: come back after 1d of so :p

i'm curious too

what does top/systat vm say

he wont be back

all those top options are important too as they show where cpu possibly goes

or memory

if it's that

the issue is really with the drm/gfx driver

maybe

i dont think the latter has anythign to do with it

cpet: i thought a lot about that

but why after 20 hs

the system im on naw is a Mac Mini

what happens after xorg kill?

video is still indeed working but

badkat: in my ealy days of usinf freebsd as my every days my system woud work fine then crash after 2-3 days

badkat: could be many things

ketas: drm is loaded after i boot the kernel so im still in the framebuffer from amd_gpu driver

unload gpu drivers maybe

badkat: however without coredump or actually info

hmm

not much ketas can do

i would start back tracking ports revs

and pin point where it fails

ports eh?

then go hey this is where my system fails and then works

so

they can deal with it

anyway first would be some debugging

as fare as I know all the drm stuff was taken out of the base system and made into a port

so yeah

probably have top running before 10s...2m pauses

those suck to get ssh up

what do you do on the desktop ?

cpet: yes i manually built drm5

play games, gimp, ?

from ports, and drm6 is for kernel 15

supposedly code ide, ff, vlc, ssh

why are you using beta code >

er ?

are you using current ?

cpet: code,ff,vlc,CAD (kicad,freecad,librecad),blender,bambu lab

manually built what

ketas

will be ketas

maybe you need rebuild but still eh weird

after 20 yrs still keta

s

drm-61-kmod

which model CPU

i have a amd 7 5700H

Ryzen 7 PRO 4750U (Renoir gpu family)

never had issues with it

but its like 5 yrs old

hmm

i never had neither, till now XD

i only have used like integrated intels...

so far

launch date 2020

now thats weird i was expecting that to be some modern recent CPU

but no

who runs video on cpu

i have a ext card I dont use the int

:)

very true

ketas: ++

i wont bother on other laptops i have, because they are running gentoo and are used as servers with battery xD

i would purchase a el cheapo ext card

and see if that has the same issue

personally

but since this is a laptop you cant do that :D

the second hand cheap sff's are the reason why it's intel video for me

those work

why would you use freebsd on a laptop ?

i had it

ketas: why would you use freebsd on a laptop ?

fbsd laptop

ketas: why?

hw broke

because i wanted

thats not an excuse

thats like the people who buy a mac and then install freebsd on it

cpet: lmao

had ose virtualbox with win and so

mac comes with freebsd userland somehow anyway

why the hell would you spend s much on HW then install a OSS OS on it ?

and playstations?

then complain that x y z doesnt work?

now i have been using freebsd for 30+ yrs

and I still use it despite the issues

but come on now

i am 41 now

cpet: my hardcore CAD workstation runs windows

disabled vet with more health issues than the VA can list

and I still use freebsd heh

maybe when freebsd supports CUDA i will drop it lmao

multi workstations are fun

badkat: see the issue is you expect to much from an OS

cpet: i dont

i mean nothing wrong

i bet you open like 500+ tabs

then bitch that the OS complains ?

to have windows also there

cpet: i dont

ok

now this doesnt help at all

but any time I have used my in house gfx

meaning the included GPU on CPU

issues arise

when I have used a ext video card

i have no issues

which issues?

does that laptop have no vid card ?

it often works

i've seen

for desktoppy purposes

ketas my gaming latop had that nvidia/cpu and you could set it to use either

i could never get it to play nice with freebsd

or any BSD

and I refuse to run linux so i sold it

yeah multigpu laptops are a thing

cpet: i patched so many games to bypass anticheat using linuxlator+glibc-shim

its so fun :)

my current system is built by myself is chumping along with current

naughty one

badkat: damn it people like you ruin it for the rest of us

actually, i got extremely good performance with intel + nvidia over freebsd

badkat: which cad soft do you use ?

cpet: i dont cheat in games, i need anticheat to be bypassed to get in the lobby lol

</curious>

only talks in games

i have a mac mini thats my main machine

:p

and I have a desktop that dua boots pretty much any os you can think of

and ketas

will always be ketas

even after 20+ yrs

ketas: hahah its a shame when you can get into the match because your game crash

same cpet too

the only games I have played on. BSD are the ones that are older than x

and even when I used to maintain doom

I still play doom ;/

cpet: Altium designer, AutoDESK products suite, engineer stuff :P

not in bsd tho, the OSS i mentioned already

what do you engineer

sex dolls

cpet: i do too :)

those are fun nowadays bte

btw

ketas out of all people man

lmao

wtf ?

ketas: electronics engi

badkat: I am a disabled veteran i dont do shit besides drink beer and goto apts

i have CKD

stage 3b

were you in tne vietnam

about 2 point from needing dialysis

ehm

cpet: ok! dont go to 14.2 you could increase the pain

seems bad

i ran 14.2 for a few months beore i moved to current

however

i started using computer with msdos

so a simple CLI with x yz program will suffice

i dont need blender to work

x)

blender is fun tho

it is

did you ever compiled the windows kernel ?

you cant compile the windows kernel

i can compile the windows kernel

:)

special boy

if you have a MS forget what its called then yeah

my brother had one

Sounds like a waste of resources

back in the day it was called I think MSDN

did any of that ever leak?

whats ts called now I Dont know

ketas: ofc

i am a student so I could possible get access to

who was sue?

sued

:p

as MS will give access to windows code to student udner some special NDA

but i dont really care much for this

cpet: roflmao thats not true

badkat: is this similar or something else ?

it's horrible nda probably

you dont get the kernel source like that, only goverments

never said kernel

i said "windows"

once you look code it burns into your brain

or meant windows

cpet: the API is pretty much documented, better than linux ofc

yeah the win32 API is well documented

but you can get entire windows src, eh?

ketas: g0vs do.

and the sources accesible to student is interesting

i mean, cool g0vs

probably not that fancy btw

its not

what you gonna do, fork it?

the source code to Windows is accessible

just MS has a ver weird way of allowing access to it

gov have access to to it without any rest

ketas: i tried to port openbsd PF to it, did a poc some time ago

students have access to a subset of it

to windows'

?

ketas: yes

badkat: you ported pf to windows ?

hahaha no kidding?

proof or youll full of it

and what happened

only can block stuff with a pretty dumb rule

i tried to port hammerfs

but it was a month experiment

windows?

and I am proud to say it was way way way out of my league

hah

eh

did it even work once :)

windows kernel is not bad at all, i mean you start to become crazy because you dont spot actual backdoor code

I’m lucky to file a decent bug report. Let alone write code

how the fuck they do it? dunno. prolly it has to do more with the out of band interface of intel or the AMD equivalent

SponiX: VA GIBill allowed me to get a BA in cybersecurity

cpet with degree

yeah but the moment i say im a disabled vet they deny all

so bleh

so do you get transplants or you would just die?

ketas: the nice thing about hammerfs is it has all the features of zfs without the ram hogging

epends on level

once it reaches a certain level it s either dyalisis or transplant

cpet: which BSD has hammerfs?

cpet: which version of hammerfs did you used as base?

SponiX: dragonfly

SponiX: DragonFly

badkat: this was long long time ago

i would say about 15 yrs ago

before I joined the .mil

I’ve never even booted that one in a vm

hammer has no volume manager

iirc

SponiX: its a very modified version of freebsd

a vary modfied version of 4.x

plus modern bits added

i would prefer a modern one such as freebsd or open

what about net

i used net for a bit

i have booted net and open

ketas: i learned PF internals from netbsd

i had a prject were I would allow student to have a shell

Luckily my FreeBSD machine has 256G

but no one would coonect to it so i killed it

256 of what ?

ram space

AI

Ram

ai?

ketas is an AI

i like the idea of 1 NVE per OS

i'm not uploaded yet

no VM's

ketas: then you are doing it wrong

cpet: you killed the free shell project? :(

pov: they logged in but cpet didn't see

ketas: hahahah

:p

badkat: not killed suspended

i killed off the VM but backups the scripts

just a matter of givien a fuck to redo it again

but thems days no one wants a shell

i gave ketas a shell like 20 yrs ago

think this was when I had bsd.ninjas

and had #bsdninjas

and ketas ruined it

how old is ketas like 70 ?

i like the name, what happened?

gave up o it

hah no

41

yeah sae 41 but feel like im 70

cpet: on which network was bsdninjas?

they say military as 20 yrs

makes sense

badkat: efnet

i recall a shell

efnet <3 really cool network

i dont do the freenode/librechat

c pet sells csh near seashore

if koobs was here I would of been banned before I said ketas!

why?

i dont know

cursing I think

or saying ketas

badkat: its dead

cpet: ye brother i got it

i gave friend a nonroot user into one jail

ketas: how come I dont get one

his microsd failed in linux rpi again

wtf man?

but you could open your house doors again :), drop some shell access here in this irc

hahaha

and no mandarin speaker will get into it >:)

i don't have enough hw for this yet

to have trusted ircfriend shellbox

and is it even needed nowadays

i fid that offensive

:p

where you from again?

.ee

romania ?

no

the land of electrical engineering :o

someone else is from .ro

im from Nauru.mil

yeah Dooshki

how fun

русский?

tiny country?

theres many

Dooshki: >:) 兄弟

translated as bro

cpet: брат!

:p

badkat: I don't recall us being family :o

i went to japan food man... holy hell

that i don't need to translatr

:)

went to guam as well

again food man...

us americans eat like garbage

unsure

i bet you can eat well in us

but yes it has issues

ketas: pretty expensive tho lma0

ketas: i moved to .us when I join in 19

iirc ice cream is ruined?

stationed in .us

but who knows

stayed in .us

last time you talked to me i was in .mx

where are you now

.us

and before it?

.mx

hmm

its ok man

i drink a lot so

;/

What does mx stand for?

mexico

mexico

Other than a DNS record

someoen doesnt know his tlds

er cctlds

some cctlds are fun

or cc's

SponiX: learn them

then you can have a .beer

like me

like have to check

i own unix.beer

:D

l0l

like where is .dj?

i miss the unprotected whois queries

:)

jamming

i miss the days when people would drink without using there fawking cell phone

why

i had this lady today just stop in the middle of the road to txt i guess

she just decided to stop

who cares about traffic

just stop

and respnd to txt

who cares about left right up down

just stop

did you press horn

no

no one cares any more man hah

should've at least blinked on her

cpet: she wont drop the "posts per minute" leaderboard so easily

yeah i can irc on phone but

on safe locationä'

i just stared at her

and lughed when she got scared when 4 people honked her

well no shit

and yelled "oh come on"?

i dont do that

i care but i dont

what do you do

depends

on my good days i honk

on my bad days i dont really care

why did your peecreators get sour anyway?

just happened?

?

well when you are in a 2 lane highway and someones just stops

people get upset

not only that its dangerous

yes of course

for some bitch to be just txting

who does that

some ..

heh

some even do it while driving

tey dont care

really easy to royally fuck up then

i got rear ending buy some kid who was high

i just said coe one man smoking that shit

it took like 500ms to react and before it you need to see

crazy to move eyes off road

you would think..

but eversince these things were invented called cell phones

peope drive worse than they did in the 90's

killphone

when all we had were big ass car phones and brick phones

now people want to tweet

im driving...

no one cares

m with my girl driving...

no one cares man

the fact that ketas still knows who i am

they stopped tweeting now

is impressive

hah

now they just have sex

i mean x

i soent 10 days in inpatieint psych ward

why

and 10 more days in outpatient psych ward

and ketas still knows who i am

why^2

i wonder if you were in mental hospital

why?

during missing times

ircmissing

that is what a psych ward is

heh

or died but that doesn't reverse

why should i forget cpet anyway

i dont know

btw, what about this

ketas will be ketas

git pulls machine down

ketas is the ketas

wired goes 100% ram, userland kills off

think i used to call you ketas moetas

or some shit

and this has zfs

4g ram but still wtf

you need a new provider

i will not use any us provider..

the resource the cost ratio is utter garbage

what I pay for my VPS i will be paying 100+ in .us

when its a fraction in .de

what helps is

[core] packedGitWindowSize = 8m packedGitLimit = 32m preloadIndex = false [diff] renameLimit = 100

:/

wtf

your git is messed up man

funnily with this limit, it works

kill it with fire and find another

not that slow even

tree is ports and ram is 4g :p

my ram is 12g

my spce is 120gb

spce?

space

the space of all spaces man

this provider offers SSD or NVE

now we all know NVE is faster

so I chode NVE

however NVE offers less

ketas

what tims is it in .es

in .es, no idea

gmt+1? or 0'

according to google

tallin, es

its 9am

alost 10am?

2025-04-26 09:24:05 +0300

/exec -out date '+%F %T %z'

yeap

:p

its about 1am

here

and i am enjoying last 2 beers

a chatter in similar/same channel on libera gave me this script: mirror.davidchmelik.com/math/cpu_info ... anyone know who made it? It's commented what it does, and year of this version, but not who made it

Safari can not open this link

github link?

wtf is it

aids

which link? Mine or previous chatter? Mine is simply a text file that can be run as a UNIX/GNU/Linux script, though lacks filename extension

?

unrelated

that link doesnt resolve

so i dont know

ketas

ask ketas hes the lat night guru

yea

Host mirror.davidchmelik.com not found: 3(NXDOMAIN)

yeah

post some bogus link man

wtf

ketas++

thanks for notifying me; that site should be back up in some hours

hours?

hahaha

add monitoring

dns was there too or why no resolves

if it takes houts to fix a DNS issue

you suck miserably

;/

even ketas can agree on that

cause hes the ketas

well it could take ttl time to update it

but

once DNS seens a serial number chage it will or should refresh itself

i run my dns partially off free services

i run my DNS off a netgate firewall

ketas is cheap++

auth dns?

:p

yeah

i use it locally for 192.168.0.0/16

i'm surprised afraid even works still

think thats the cidr

:D

xname went bust

zoneedit got bought

this is why you dont go free

if you go free use something decent like he.net

it still gives legacy users a service

or whatever is the equivalent in .eu

legacy isnt always good

especially these days

i remeber when I had a hosting account with aplus

and its infrustrure was half BSD half linux

hostings are all gone now

no, it means I don't have a lot of money

and the BSD side was old as hell

i had some

darwin: i dont either

think my bank account right bow is 0.58

:D

think ketas has mre than me

how do you even eat

lucky bastard

i dont

people die that way

meds dont make me hungry so i dont bother

i made pound cake earlier

ate a few slices

need like 2.3kwh per day

well the needs are met

the extras are not

meaning i cant buy a new vid card

but i can buy a coke

etc..

the black or white one?

bottle coke ?

the fuck man

black one then :p

you racist bastard

we need to make cocacola white again

or now white

bleach it

we used to have clear pepsi

that shit was the shit

that shit was the shit of all the shits if it was the shit

then it was discontinued

and then someone said lets bring it back

and the it tasted like orange cola

sad day when i was like 12

ketas: I remeber when I lived close to atlanta

and we went to the coke museum

the amount of weird colas we tasted

we tasted one that was basically cumcumber

from .ru

as weird as it sounded that shit was good ;/

eh

i dont know

its been what 10+ yrs since ive last bee here ?

if not more than that ?

yea i was wondering where you went

can you recommend a good nerd movie?

hackers

cpet: best .mil movie involving computers

stupid movie but

lol i saw them all

hunter killer

2018?

i dont know

i came out a yr before i went to basic

hahah wtf? aprox date?

cpet: best .mil movie with actual hacking / tailored operations action over tech?

honestly man the best .mil movie is AMerican sniper

as a retired disabled vet, that movie ,,

i saw that one, is good

as for hacking

i meant tailored access operations mil movie

hollywood has a way of exagerating a bit

hmm usebox.net/jjm/blog/finding-a-free-secondary-dns

yeah eventually i could host own

i host my own

cpet: yes to many blinking warnings on hackin related movies

cpet: single dns eh?

you want the cheesy one hackers you want a decent one hacker

with Haylie Duff

cpet: im a decent hacker i dont deserve less

as a student in cyber sec

most movies in the theme of hacking are/is bs

real hacker movies?

totally, i just like operation takedown which relates to mitnick

i mean its fun

now that movie

where ipv6 doesn't contain letter s?

:)

was a decent hacker movie

i'm impressed they used reak ipvy

ipv6

too bad he passed away

hahah and operation swordfish have ipv5 or something like that

hallywood

321.123.123.111

you will never see a decent hacker movie in hollywood

:P

but still went for 3d magic and data sounds

i did like the movie with pierce brownan though

hahahah the 3d cube ye

yeah it's too difficult to setup props maybe

and boring to watch

totally boring and meaningless to random people of course...

they need action 8-)

imagine staring at quiet terminal and after a hour someone farts

or so

only you rhink that shit up man

wtf

not very hollywood

xD

i think the only hacker movie that resembles what ive studied is operation takedown

or hackers 2

the rest is all holly garbage

well even that is weird

the rest is all defcon videos

tbh

ketas you are weird

but thats ok

i still have my defcon 12 DVD somewhere

some scifi is coolä'

the video regarding ssl with moxie

was impressive

and why cause we use ssl like its our new savior

cpet: now its all about black hoodies and RGB keyboards *pukes*

i wear a black hoodie

im wearing a black hoodie too

my keyboard is a logitech pebble

connected to a mac

;/

but i dont approve RGB in my home

dont hate if you got something better

freebsd uses a logitech gaming keybord

black hoodies

i wear all the black

all of it

i just do darker colors

black

cargo pants tho

:p

yeap

my original PC was a Lenovo Legion

worked fine even with freebsd

was it milspec

it wasnt until i took out the light board that it started to act up

wtf name

so I decided to rebuild it using parts of parts

so new case, MB

but same ram and CPU

and took all the RBG garbage out

right now it runs as my windows, freebsd, cachy os, slackware,

cpet: did you ever used freebsd on a rugged mil laptop?

PC

hah miltop

i was a construction mechanic all we did is work of shit

the IT guys would be a better option to ask

lol

funnily, i do host mail now

with free mx backup currently

just no other services were fitting anymore

i want a .ketas.eu

i love India military rugged laptops, best green in the world, but specs are shitty for sure lolol

chris⊙fke

;/

i did mail before actually but never used it actually much

badkat: computers change to quick to really matter

i remeber my first PC was a 66mhz DX2 with 32 mb of ram and a 2gb upgrae HD

what was that bombproof one?

panasonic?

it's all metal

now my PC has 6 NVE's and 64GB of ram

helllll 6

eh

the rugger laptops are made by panasonic

i wonder which lenovo could do dual ssd

and you can literily kick them like a foot ball and they still chump and boot up

or i could do ssd + hdd too which would be hacky

impressive but exp as fuck

dell have some rugged toys too

for the pos they are resource wise

the freebsd foundation has late done laptop support program now

i got mad one time and kicked one and it hit a truck

someone donated or so

and picked it up and it still chumped on so yeah

aweomse laptops

but the price ...

ketas: yes, i wish they finish the AX200 driver soon :)

works half speed in comparison with linux

it's indeed in works

wireless ...

i wish i can do ap as well

the progress is there

i was amazed how easy it is to crack a wireless network

i even found bugs

according to ethical hacking 101

and a few programs

ax200 cant use hostap?

wpa2?

well maybe it can

all the WPA

wpa3'

even ketas WPA

?

well run vpn over wpa :p

have your onion

no not WPA3 "yet"

cpet: enterprise wpa is easier to hack than home networks xD

let hackers peel and cry

hackers++

but i want to make fbsd aps

all good cards are pcie

my wireless is a asus wifi 7 router

but what supports pcie

nothing

and I chose this one as I can change the channels

and it ook me a very long time

you can do that, you dont need much special hardware

to figure out which channel didint make my shit slow

my old linksys you could not

freebsd ieee802_11 stack is pretty good

i sold it on ebay its gone

server, yes, laptop, yes, embedded, well basically none

usb adapters to rescue!

but they have own issues

i have gig cable with a /29

wifi is no good

less tx power

i have to have one desktop connected wired to hav full access

besides we have like whole 2 persons on wifi dev?

cpet: ofc, i dont want chinese speakers gettin on my wlan

or else i should really be paying for 300mbit

whats wrong with chines e speakers ?

you racist bastard

they have lot of 0days to throw at me

you can learn a lost on creating a jail and having a password of password

and just having anything login

and its amusing as fuck when you see them trying to compile linux stuff on it and it fails

amusing

i love that

i had a openbsd honeypot

i just sit and watch

an watch

and make fun of badkat

and watch some more

however this did not work so mcuh on my rasp pi

as that indeed got owned

* shits near cpet tech setup *

to this day I do not know how they managed to recompiled my openbsd kernel

but they did

and the only way i noticed is when I saw the ethernet port rapidly blinking

and took it offline

openbsd is useless

it runs my server stuff

if i need security i just turn down the computer

i think this was something due to uboot

not the os itself

and smash the fuck out the board with a hammer

you have anger issues

and operation security

kind of like when you ask the tech support and they say well change your ssh port

when freebsd has a very decent means of blocking such

taken from netbsd

something I wish openbsd had

thats one thing that always puzzled

me

so i built myself a new mail system, with a twist

it doesn't have spam filter but

the people who go oh this is chinese made its garbage

it has 500 aliases

99% of computers are made there

:p

and 99% of the time I blame ketas

i want slaps@

ketas gib me slaps@

now

change ssh port?

to what

2222

non-22?

22222

34

35

45

67

89

76

543

yeah maybe it's good

3444

5655

6555

actually <1024 is good

change port to 8

well i dare you to run sshd on 1

:)

why

my ssh runs on 22

we have firewalls for a reason

connect to server.unix.beer

hophosts?

or security.unix.beer port 1984

well yes

or ketas.es port 22

wtf is it your domain

i brew beer

as a hobby

i dont work i dont do shit

so i figured brewing beer would be fun

so i mae unix.beer

yay me

why not work

end of story

brain works

i am a disabled veteran

has fbsd inside it

more like corrupt fbsd inside it

why

cause

i was fucked before now im more than i was before

but yeah sadly i have to run mail on mail ports

:p

i have biz class inet

so I dont have ports limited

otherwise port 25 is filtered

that stopped here

out was filtered too

what stopped

in was able to be removed

by isp

on request

well for the amount of people that probe my email server in a day

compred to the early 90's

is in the holy fuck range

Why would outgoing 25 be blocked

you need that to send mail

even on residental

now just every mail server blocks dyn

appledash: remeber you have out and in

most

funnily noone blocks v6

you can send email out and receive from a different port

and most service these days dont use "25"

but either the others

imap imaps

SMTPD

so my postfix just retries on v6

er SMTPD

and gets it through

SMTPS

fuck

into google and microsoft too

:)

i was surprised

ketas remeber when I had bsd.ninja

unsure what they check really

and i had console email

i stil do that

maybe they are like

dyn

you have to logn to receive email

but has all enabled

best email

is logged in email

let it pass

webmail gives you anal polyops

i have spf, dkim and dmarc on it

like fully compliant mail service

really

How drunk are yall

prove it

appledash: 6 pack just finished

why not quitting?

appledash: but i have known ketas for 20+ yrs

me too

i think since 2001

or 2002

(that's a lie)

everyone spams, that's why 25

appledash: tasting some meth over here :))

wtf

Meth is for when you need to do linux, not freebsd

hahah you are right :(

shit if you need meth to use either you need to gtfo off the PC

thats for ubuntuers

walther white shite

i liked ubuntu

but this was in like 2005

but now blocks are off

i liked slackware

but it has a bug

but someone creative in .ee had idea to block some sites with dns

that bug is after you update kernel and dont do a manualt initrd you system fails to boot

I would wager it has many bugs

love govts

VPN bypass that shit

well it's just dns

so i can run my own recursive

appledash: anything made by college grads i buggy as hell

appledash: any software is buggy as hell

it mirrors roots too, whole deal

having 56 forks of software x from github doesnt help

this is why using freshports is amusing now

it has almost ever git hosting provider known

slackware at least feels BSDish

yeap

but I killed my install earlier after an update

i used winlinux once, then mandrake, then redhat

then local honeypot ran fbsd

so installed 4.6

forgot to do a mkinitrd

:)

and rebooted

there was WinBSD too

bam

*BSD doesnt have this issue

or Win4BSD something like that

all if not all BSD desktop OS's have died

with the exception of midnight

but that shit is garbage

it's win *ON* bsd

the indea is awesome

but the code is garbage

the idea behind PCBSD was awesome

but the code was garbage

yeah sad that pcbsd went bust

but any complex system will have bugs

ketas: yes, im trying to find a magazine scan i have somewhere

pretty old

cpet: NomadBSD its pretty good

now I have been using freebsd for a long time and I have yet to have a system not boot up after a system upgrade

my freesbie cd-r still booted uo

up

:)

most linux die

sucker still worked

after

i actually want to have own xorg live

found it

eventually

and those new linux system that are rolling releases

well

i personally like opensuse

i do have console better live

only linux distro i can use

and even that breaks at times

it was BSD on windows, another bizarrre stuff

actually windows have some bsd already (netstat)

hah bsd on win

and other TCP/IP stack utils

really!

widnows has the whole tcp/ip stack

back in the day

exactly

now im sure its the same shit just modified

is the bootstrap they used to get into the internet :D

anyone ever recalls kern.flp?

:)

not really :O

so if I was a ompany

lets call me PCS

had to swap it for mfsroot.flp

i wanted software to help me connect to the intnernet

after bootup

would I use a GPL OS that forces me to serve src

or would I use a BSD that allows me to keep it closed

i would keep it closed

one thing a lot of people dont realize is

lmao ofc you dont give shit back, i didnt see any nintendo or sony contributors

only from netflix, if we talk about the fbsd abusers :)

well nintendo is probably the shitiest comp

in that regard

sony does give a little back to be fair

they do?

nintendo still files lawsuits for nintendo games not even sold any more

nomadbsd still exists

for ready live needs

i used to mirror for nomadbsd

then I forgot why I stopped

it haves cool zfs configuration by default

pretty good for non techy users also

my pool is named beer

and I have a pool named beer/more

juniper gives code back also

lol open the unix.beer ssh and give us creds

cpet: ^

from large companies

i lack of i

imagination so

f5 used openbsd kernel also as base some years ago

i now name my machies after colors

and pools get metals

badkat: f3FkUPtBLlXdyQTPe4vmxrDUrLKKpevj

:)

decrypt that

you get access to

i thought it was password

lma0

:p

tell me the decryption algorithm and the decrypted assword

cicada3001 lets go

and you get root on unix.beer

which runs on my cable connection

xD

why root

cause if he can guess that

he deserved root

hah

because you can't even guess that isn't it

in 1000+ years?

:)

if you have a GPU farm

if i get the algo you give me guest access

takes less

hmm .beer is not expensive?

weird

i dont need root, i will call my chinese friend to escalate privs with some nasty communist 0day

now you aint getting shit no matter what you say

hah

hah

:O

ha

looks like sex toy

but is not

thats what people think when they see ketas

;/

chinese made sex toy

those use netbsd ofc

i'm bad toy

obsd lives exist too

badkat: npf is quit nice

npf is used by japanese ISPs

ketas unix.beer run on openbsd

it has a interesting library also

yeap

when I opened up madhatter.

it was using netbsd

but since no one connected i closed

and obsd has official live too

CS class with a free shell and no one connected

fbsd should also do it maybe

if this was in the 90's my machine would of been riddled with eggdrops

heh

maybe i'll contribute my live ideas and it will exist

satanic brain BBS

that was a cool place to get phucked

cpet: hah

eggdrop still exists!

funnily

ketas: i maintain eggdrop

going strong

and even has a cute logo

badkat: certain places on the dark web

can be said will fuck you heh

not really worried about a BBS

i said it WAS

when telephony had something to do :))

you can still dialup to BBS's

mostly synchronet

i remebered I tried to create a port for it