ok

say I have a startup

and I want to run it on freebsd I see werc.cat-v.org varnish and ha-proxy as my stack

but what about router and firewall? pfsense?

or should I learn openbsd.org for the firewall?

maybe no time for that I should just learn freebsd better

sounds like its goin great already

by the way has anyone here worked on file servers and had to up the default no open file? I did it other day but the system seemed to not use the higher limit

even though I opened new xterm to start qbittorrent

I want to try some ideas about not using a database at all and using all files

werc seems like mega simple and would be fast to deliver results

vely.dev this seems interesting too and perhaps higher performance, but settign aside performance and maxxing for simplyicy werc might win

Title: vely:

esp since I am not C guru

I see such waste fraud and bs in software corps I work for

and honestlyy postgresql left sour taste in my mouth since it was used through and ORM

so you coldnt even use it right and even then it had billion knobs

Then I read baker on sql db being a scam

Title: Henry Baker on relational database scam - Pastebin.com

that letter has not aged well

so why did this nosql thing come about?

not for any reason Baker gives, certainly

from the history of recent usage of "nosql", the main driver was doing horizontally-distributed databases

these things were mostly key-value stores rather than (for example) hierarchical, object or pointer databases

(and in the meantime, sql has acquired recursion, solving the bill-of-materials problem very neatly)

also, Baker praises object-oriented databases which in practice have been a complete flop

gemtalk systems says smalltalk works nicely but that might be message passing more than oo I guess

mongodb seems to be growin

every sql place I have worked was slow to develop mess stuck with orm using devs and offshore bs

living hell to import data from foreign db too

if all apps used files could you do report and 'analytics' by chaining together data processing scripts?

those don't sound like sql problems

seems simpler that huge sql hackery

how would you expect to do that? do you know all the file formats?

if I design the app sure

and that format can be shared so apps can be done in any language

but nobody else is going to use your format

backups n scaling become easy just copy files to new box or even use something like mogileFS which is like file load balancing

others talk HTML

tcp/ip

as new apps are needed they are created

something like slack which I am stunned anyone pays for ez

you might even publish files that are half processed data and apps can then take it from there in a few different customer reports for different divisions

get rid of service now jira confluence

slaesforce

all the oracle .net crud

cerainly ban agile and devops

hek ban MBA and project mgr

:)

Good morning!

When setting up wireguard in FreeBSD 13.2... where do I put the .conf file for the wg-interface? Or can I exclusively set it up vía the wg command?

I couldn't find any hint to that, neither in "man wg", nor in "man if_wg"

and most of the tutorial on the internet refer to the "old"/"pre 13.2" way, where wireguard was installed as a package

i have mine in /usr/local/etc/wireguard

i use wireguard from pkg

my thinking was "why install the packages, when wg is natively supported in 13.2?"

it wasn't so back then

there was an early attempt to have wiregurad in base but it was some scandal about it. so wireguard from pkg was the way.

right, but that's apparently been fixed since

Yes, indeed.

okay, I am tempted to report a bug for that, if there's no way to store wg config as files somewhere

either it's "a bug" on how wireguard works or it's a bug in the documentation

ah, okay...... I can somehow hack it with the setconf/synconf sub-commands

hmm... but with the native wg I am not allowed to specify Address and DNS within the wg-conf :-/

RhDoc, in rc.conf <- wireguard_enable="YES" , wireguard_interfaces="wg0" ...and config file is placed in: /usr/local/etc/wireguard/wg0.conf

RhDoc, service wireguard start

that's for wireguard in ports/pkg, no?

pvalenta, and one missing peace: pkg install wireguard-tools

RhodiumToad, it uses if_wg from base

but init script is from wireguard-tools package

and if_wg_load="YES" to /boot/loader.conf ...I hope that's all :)

there's no wireguard in base

orly?

unless it was in base, was removed and then was reintroduced in base

pvalenta: config in /usr/local/etc/wireguard/wgN.conf with the wireguard packages, right?

I mean, I don't have wireguard packages installed but I got a /usr/bin/wg

it is in 13.2 -> freebsd.org/releases/13.2R/announce

Title: FreeBSD 13.2-RELEASE Announcement | The FreeBSD Project

there's ... what the shit.

[elliot@dorn ~]$ which wg

/usr/bin/wg

i didn't install you

RhDoc, yes, but init script and wg-quick is missing in base

rtprio: hahaha

but there was a big todo about when the dude chcked it in without enough oversight

and it was prompty reverted

okay, so it seems that there's some unfinished business with wg and FreeBSD base

744bfb213144c63cbaf38d91a1c4f7aebb9b9fbc Fri Oct 28 13:36:12 2022 -0700

i'll be damned

RhDoc, yes,...look at man if_wg ...there is some recipe how to run it by hand ....but config file and init script is much easier

RhodiumToad: i also forget i run a 2 year old snapshot of current on my main host because the raid card was removed from the tree

pvalenta: alright, I'll try to configure it in the rc.conf a little later

anyone happen to have gtk4 installed and can test something for me?

But I have to check out a solution for the DNS thing... (I guess it's a convenience part in macOS wireguard impl that I can declare a DNS server for the tunnel, which I am not able to do in FreeBSD)

I have gtk4-4.10.3 installed

RhodiumToad: what do you need?

run gtk4-demo and select "peg solitaire"

RhDoc, adding DNS = ?.?.?.? under [Interface] in wg0.conf should work

then try an illegal move such as moving a peg to the hole it came from, or moving an adjacent peg to the center

when I am moving "a peg" to the hole it came from it and drop it it just disappears

ok. what version does pkg info gtk4 say

and you don't by any chance have a linux system handy to do the same test?

pvalenta: well, I get the following error ->

Line unrecognized: `DNS=10.42.100.10,some.domain.com'

Configuration parsing error

RhodiumToad: sure - I just need to spin up the VM

also, were you running that on a local display, not over network?

RhodiumToad: pastebin.com/5Si2ySiC

Title: gtk4-4.10.3Name : gtk4Version : 4.10.3Installed on : Fr - Pastebin.com

yeah - that was local

thanks

RhDoc, in man wg-quick ..... DNS — a comma-separated list of IP (v4 or v6) addresses to be set as the in-

RhodiumToad: okay, I have a debian VM, but there's no gtk4-demo

don't worry about it

it's probably a separate package or something

pvalenta: yeah, well... I need to install the wireguard packages then, because wg-quick isn't available in base

RhDoc, you could use dnsproxy and configure it to use 10.42.100.10,some.domain.com .....and in wg0.conf DNS=IP.OF.DNS.PROXY:PORT

RhDoc, it's a really small package containing only 10 files

hmm... seems like there's no gtk4 in debian 11 apt - from what I've seen it's just in unstable/experimental

pvalenta: can dnsproxy be configured dynamically? it should configure that DNS when the wg interface comes up and use another dns when the interface goes down... (in my naive view :D )

RhDoc, i think openvpn should by able to do that on server side ...you can set custom DNS on client config only

RhDoc, the second part of previous sentence is for wireguard

I guess I need to check out the wireguard packages and see if the tunnel DNS works when using wg-quick then

RhDoc, it works (not tested on freebsd) but on client side, so in client1-wg-quick.conf can be DNS=1.1.1.1 and on client2-wg-quick.conf can be DNS=1.2.3.4

yeah - I installed wireguard-tools (where wg-quick is part of) and using this it works

and - I am talking about client-side, that the client's DNS should adapt according to the wg-interface state

but I can confirm: it works using wg-quick

as expected and needed

now I can work with my FreeBSD desktop on my OpenBSD servers XD

perfect

(and probably also setup a poudriere build-server for my packages)

freshbsd.org/freebsd/src/commit/240…80aac7eaf8019aa0939224bbce2d561d01f apparently freebsd can boot in 25ms

Title: FreeBSD / src / 2404380 / tslog: Optionally instrument pmap_zero_page - FreshBSD

Title: FreeBSD / src / 469cfa3 / tslog: Annotate some early boot functions - FreshBSD

freshbsd.org/freebsd/src/commit/9a3444d91c and freshbsd.org/freebsd/src/commit/9b1d87286c7 are also a pair of interesting commits

Title: FreeBSD / src / 9a3444d / ossl: Add a VAES-based AES-GCM implementation for amd64 - FreshBSD

"and probably also setup a poudriere build-server for my packages" - well, that was easy :D

No reason it shouldn't be.

Hi, loading i915kms annd amdgpu simultaneously casues the system to not boot/panic/crash. I found this bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=271897 to be related, but the title says 'drm-510-kmod', i installed only drm-kmod, after a bit fo research, i understood drm-kmod is a meta package and drm-510-kmod is part of it. But how do i know if my system uses drm-510-kmod or something

else? should i continue in the same bug as above or raise a new one for drm-kmod?

Title: 271897 – graphics/drm-510-kmod: loading amdgpu and i915kms kernel modules simultaneously causes the system to crash

the issue was cross-referenced here -> freebsd/drm-kmod #168 by grahamperrin

Title: Kernel panic when load of radeonkms is followed by load of amdgpu or i915kms · Issue #168 · freebsd/drm-kmod · GitHub

168 – no documentation on macros in machine/floatingpoint,h bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=168

On a second thought i ask a lot of questions,than just go and do it and see what happens ;)

may be i will go ahead and comment and not worry about being told off, or RTFM,:D

how do i allow jails to connect from the outside world to another jail on the host? or should I bend the DNS to just connect directly?

root@builder:~ # curl -Lv alpha.pkgbase.live/stable/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest

* Trying 64.176.184.217:443...

* Immediate connect fail for 64.176.184.217: Connection refused

Title: Index of /stable/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest

let's go with /etc/hosts for now

Anyone happen to know why a "pkg install lang/rust" would want to also require installing mysql 5.7 client and server?

I don't see any dependency for mysql in the lang/rust/Makefile or anything.

ek, pkg rall-depends rust -> prints only curl for me

pvalenta: Same for me. Yet, when I run a "pkg install rust" or "pkg upgrade rust" it wants to install mysql57. I already have mysql80 installed. Not sure what's going on.

Mysql57 is the default

cpet: I understand. But, why require it to be installed at all?

Install it then remove mysql57 see what else it removes

When you see it request the dep be removed or use poudriere and build it yourself

I generally only use "pkg" for large builds (such as rust) with 48-cores, it still takes like an hour to build. :(

I'll give removal via pkg a shot and see what happens.

They all failed since mysql80 is already installed. Rust did upgrade, though. So, I'd imagine it'll just do the same thing next time. *shrugs*

It must just be some old pkg DB info somewhere or something.

ek, try pkg install --ignore-missing rust

Or just install mysql57

Applications I use no longer support or will be moving away from MySQL 5.x soon. So, unfortunately, not an option.

pvalenta: I'll give that a shot next time. Thanks!

Do you don't want to build it and you don't want to just install the dep

ek, I have no server with mysql installed, only one with mariadb and pkg install rust on that server does not want to install mysql ....so I don't know, where is problem

cpet: I don't mind building it. I do sometimes. But, if I don't have to, why would I?

And, there is no MySQL dep for rust. That's what I've been saying. I don't know why it wants to install it at all.

pvalenta: No idea either.

ek, pkg install --ignore-missing rust ... does not work too?

pvalenta: I'll try removing rust and reinstalling and see what happens.

ek, are you using only official binary packages or mix with ports or poudriere builds?

pvalenta: I actually mainly only build from ports. I just wanted to upgrade rust without building. So, mixing.

holy crap, the password hash from linux (in puppet) worked to set freebsd user password!

Demosthenex: what do you mean?

sozuba: i ran puppet resource user X on a linux box, it outputs name, gid, uid, etc and included the hashed password. using that manifest record on a freebsd box, it appears to have imported the password corretly

i mean... they are both likely using sha256 or sha512 to store it

but i've had no success copying hashes across OS's in the past ;]

ah okay got it

sounds cool

:)

See that's where it gets complicated mixing

heheh. i had a fun time once. i had to move 2500 users from openvms to aix... without issuing all new passwords

users logged in with telnet at the time for a console app. so i went to home depot, made 2x ethernet taps, and used two junk pc's to run a network dump of the first 512 bytes of each login. i left these behind the main serverse at two sites for a month.

after 2 months, a little perl and i recreated all users and their passwords with 95% accuracy!

of course, i immediately drilled those HDD's and smashed them ;]

what can i say, openvms and aix use different hashes ;]

Demosthenex, Just a reminder that on FreeBSD the master password file is /etc/master.passwd and that pwd_mkdb(8) compiles it to the other files. :-)

I would be worried that a Linux puppet recipe would assume the Linux distro standard of /etc/passwd /etc/group and /etc/shadow and not know about pwd_mkdb.

rwp: me as well, thats why i'm surprised :P

just git downloading the ports colelction is causing my laptop to heat up 90 C:(

Demosthenex, The puppet must have included a FreeBSD specific recipe then.

What type of laptop? A lot of laptops have problems getting the heat out.

sozuba: how big is it?

2gb

Is it an HP by chance ?

(Half the fun of the Mechwarrior game is designing a machine and using it at a rate that does not heat shutdown. Laptops are like that too.)

Never had my legion heat up

only 2gb? O_o

Most newer machines will throttle clock rate if they get too hot. I have that happen all of the time on one of my machines.

manu1: 1 G

rwp: well freebsd is a supported platform, so i expect they should do it correctly by now ;]

cpet: nope lenovo edge e450.

You can make it smaller if you ignore the history and just get the files

You would think

Also, right now i have a bug with excessive heating and have raised a PR, so this is expected, but didn't expect it with git cloning :)

Does the e450 even have a fan? I thought that model was purely passively cooled through the case bottom. (Maybe I am thinking of a different model?)

Running freebad on top of the line hw

Tisk tisk

I don't see how overheating a laptop could be a software bug in git or FreeBSD. It's simply a design tradeoff from the laptop vendor.

rwp: it does have a fan over the CPU

this is actually an issue with freebsd, as i don;tface this on linux

Since most people don't actually USE a laptop machine for actually DOING anything. Other than in very short bursts when a web page loads. They make it smaller and lighter by avoiding airflow space.

cpet: defintely top of the line :D

sozuba, I assume that if you were to compile a big project source on the Linux kernel that it would be similar. (But maybe Linux throttles more aggressively on temperature.)

For a while some years ago that was an advantage of Intel CPUs which had better throttling than AMD. Search for web videos of people destroying AMD CPUs by removing the heat sinks and recording a video showing the smoke burning out of them.

rwp, i haven't even compiled yet and i am not being preferential to linux here either, please read bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=271938

Title: 271938 – Excessive heating on Lenovo Thinkpad E450 even with CPU @ 100% idle

I amnew to freebsd and I am facing some issues, whuch people here have been very kind to help me with

sozuba, I think you are running into an area where the Linux kernel has better CPU power management than the FreeBSD kernel. No doubt. But is that a bug? I think it is an undeveloped feature that still needs development on FreeBSD.

i amjust trying to sort things on my onw,while i wait for things. This git clone of ports was one of the steps, to bukd something and i've never had my gut clone reach 90 C before.May be this is normal.

But I was sharing this here, as i have been doing for a few days since I am here, so people who know my issue can be updated

rwp,did you read my PR?

git uses SHA hashes for everything and computing those will use some CPU resources (heating things up).

sozuba, Yes I read your PR immediately after you posted it.

so you think that getting 60 C when the CPU is idle is expected?

fresh system, right after boot, een froma state of cool down and rest*

even*

It might be. It depends upon the exact CPU. It depends upon the hardware vendor have adequate heat sink and heat dissipation.

ok

My old Thinkpad T42 was rock solid and never got more than warm. My Thinkpad X220 is a hot little box and will thermal throttle when I am just surfing the web randomly and will definitely overheat if I am compiling something on it.

let's just agree to disagree

What's the difference between them? For one the old T42 had a slower CPU and just couldn't generate as much heat. But it also had better heat sink and air flow and it got the heat out of the box.

My X220 was designed as a smaller travel system and being smaller it just has less good heat dissipation. It gets VERY HOT.

Meanwhile my this century Starlite has no fan but is heatsinked to the aluminum case base. It gets quite warm too and also thermal throttles but the CPU is newer and more efficient and just does not heat up as much.

sozuba, When I read your PR I read it that you would like the FreeBSD kernel to be as good at CPU power management as the Linux kernel. And I agree with that! I would like that too. I think we all would. Meanwhile I am not a kernel developer. So I will defer to those that are that read the PR and respond to it.

I can see how it is surprising that a git clone just by itself would heat up so much. It does not seem like more than pouring data around. But all of the SHA calculations needed means that a git clone is not as light weight as simply copying data from the net to the local storage. It is actually doing some work there too.

Plus if it is on ZFS then there are more block checksums being computed there as data is written to the file system. (I would still always use ZFS. It is well worth it.)

rwp: i am not an exepert in anything discussed here. I amjust a normal user that likes to move from using linux to freebsd and build on from that. Unfortunately i have to make do with the machine i have, at least for a long while. People who are more experience than me and have been using freebsd for a long time, trued helping to sort the heating issue, but unfortunately it didn't work. It's with

their advise and help that i raised the PR, and so far no one has diagreed that this unexpected increase in temperature is abnormal. May be you are an exert, but I am going to leave it at that.

sozuba, I am not a kernel developer and I will defer to those more expert about it than I. And it will be interesting to read their comments in the PR.

I also spent many years in the Linux world and have in the past few years returned to BSD again. (I'll say again since it was many years before when I ran BSD and then moved to Linux. But now re-discovering BSD all over again.)

I wasn;t being sarcastic, You may not be a kernel developer,but you may know things and that's why i said you may be an expert. But I am not, I just learn and just play aroundand sometimes help with what i know. But regardign what we discussed, i disagree on many points.

Let me say that it is okay if you and I disagree about something. I am often out-voted by the world! :-)

same here

"They called me mad, and I called them mad, and damn them, they outvoted me." --Nathaniel Lee

ah its a quote

I really want FreeBSD to run on my laptop. But so far my excusions there have been less than great. So though I am running FreeBSD on about half my systems I am still running Linux on my laptops that I am actively using.

I only have one laptop that is experimentally running FreeBSD and I am using it to work through the difficulties of running FreeBSD there.

does anyone know how to change the display name temporarily? Like " Sozuba is know as xxxxx". I just want to chnage it into TypoKing

IRC clients use "/nick foo" to change the nickname to "foo". But I advise against it because we get known by our nicks. And I am not sure how that interacts with nick registration. Hmm...

rwp: i have only on machine a Lenovo Thinkpad Edge E450 since 2016 and I don'tthink i buy another one for a while. So this is my only machine and i just have to deal with it :)

Thanks rwp

I am a craphound and so only rarely have anything new but am always scrounging old equipment from everywhere.

rwp: that's nice

I have been moving toward smaller machines for every day carry in my backpack. My shoulder gets tired of the weight of the heavier machines! So machines like your Lenovo E450 are very attractive to me. They are small, sexy, and very light!

rwp: I like my laptop too, it does its job and also i am emotionally attached to it, its been with methrough the toughest of time and still is

Remote compute++

Has anyone tried FreeBSD on HP laptops with 11.6 screen?

... oh, would also include the 12.5 in ones.

I have a HP laptop running FreeBSD, but with a larger diagonal. Probably 15.5".

V_PauAmma_V, What vintage is that?

I know of Neel C having a (larger) HP laptop at one point, neelc.org/posts/optimize-freebsd-for-intel-tigerlake

Title: Optimizing FreeBSD Power Consumption on Modern Intel Laptops -

parv, Good article! Thanks for sharing. sozuba ^^

Oh, sozuba has already left the channel. :-(

parv, it's a refurb, so not sure, but dmesg.boot has "CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-6200U CPU @ 2.30GHz", so I guess 6+ years old?

V_PauAmma_V, Thanks much

Probook 450/G2~, if that helps pin it down.

s/pin/narrow/

Er, 450/G3.

rwp, There is another related article there: neelc.org/posts/freebsd-speed-shift-laptop

Title: Tuning Power Consumption on FreeBSD Laptops and Intel Speed Shift (6th Gen and Later) -

V_PauAmma_V, I have a 2016 ThinkPad with Intel i5-6300U; so Intel-i5 6200U was enough for me to know. Thanks again

parv, I am saving those articles off in my docs!

hey, has anyone out here run into some issues with iwlwifi / Intel AX200?

What type of issues? (Not I.)

I can install FreeBSD and the live image works fine but when I try to boot and set up Wi-Fi, I'm either getting repeated error logs or kernel panic

Something similar to this: bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=267029

Title: 267029 – iwlwifi: Panic on initial network startup

I'll try installing again to get the full log

temp64, What version of FreeBSD are you installing?

13.2

temp64, "the live image works fine" also for WiFi association too? Or works fine enough to install?

rwp, it's been a while since the last time I tried, I'm not sure if I ended up plugging the ethernet cable or not

temp64, Can you use an ethernet connection or one via phone (in order to bypass iwlwifi & try the "net/wifibox" port that runs Linux iwlwifi in Alpine VM)?

temp64, Oh! In that case you could try the "net/wifibox" if you do want to deal with the native driver.

s/do want/do NOT want/

o.O

wi-fi driver in alpine vm

this sounds weird

Yes

Works better (faster, no crash) than the native driver

(until we figure out the kinks)

:fingers crossed:

temp64, Weird? Yes! But all reports are that it works really well! Check this out: jrgsystems.com/posts/2022-04-20-802.11ac-on-freebsd-with-wifibox

Title: JRG Systems - 802.11ac on FreeBSD with wifibox

parv, rwp you know, I actually managed to configure the wi-fi in the installer

maybe it's going to work this time :D

I'll be holding my breath in anticipation of your report! :-)

i really shouldn't have tried installing src tree onto this barely-functional 32gb pendrive

part of an install is src and ports

cpet, I usually uncheck src and ports when doing a binary install on testing systems as it isn't needed and might as well save the planet by not burning the power to do it. :-)

seeing how the whole world relies on servers I really doubt that will help any

rwp: must be an old school thing, been using a BSD for 30+ years

It's not a bad thing! It's just that Linux distros (other than from source distros) have gotten everyone into the habit of binary only installs.

FreeBSD works very well as a binary installed and binary upgraded system. That's mostly the way I use it.

freebsd-upgrade and pkg upgrade and so on and everything works very fast and very nice.

I dont do much freebsd work any more ive moved on to other things but every now and then ill see an issue _try_ and fix it or ask someone who knows better

Unless "{src,ports}" are Git clones, I do not see the point of installing during installation

and I like to vim /usr/src/path rather than look at ugly cgit UI or mess with git as a whole

parv, /usr/{src,ports} are tar file dumps which freebsd-upgrade keeps updated when it makes a binary system update.

thunder storm is coming time to sit outside and watch it

rwp: will ignore if it cant find them

my VPS has 500GB im sure I can give 4gb for ports and src

the least I can do

The next thing I am going to say will be heresy for cpet I am sure but most users will never wish to go look at the source.

rwp, Ah, I did not know "freebsd-update" (right, not "-upgrade") did that.

Though I *really like* having the source available to answer those questions that man pages gloss over. "What is it really doing? Let's go look at the source!"

s/freebsd-upgrade/freebsd-update/g for everything I just said. (I usually freebsd-upTAB and let tab expansion complete it for me! It's rotted my memory of it.)

lol All good

cpet don't miss the light show of the thunderstorm! We will be here when you get back in. :-)