00:02:10 right, so you're probably still descending into other ports that depend on them 00:02:25 ps -d may be somewhat enlightening here 03:42:24 kevans: sorry for the delay, fell asleep in my chair... ps -d shows a LOT of output. It's a tree so I can only see the command for the first 15 or so. There are 25077 lines in the file I piped the output to... 03:44:33 The top-level make command seems to be py-recommonmark 04:40:47 de 04:40:57 demido: what was the cause of your swap 04:42:14 no clue 04:42:40 tried a 3rd time, this time with a separate partition for the vm images. same prob 04:43:02 so now i'm trying with 2 raid arrays. 2nd array mounted and holding the vm images 04:43:08 we'll see how that goes 04:46:00 if it doesn't work then ufs is pretty much garbageware and i don't think i can use freebsd because these servers have perc 730p mini raid cards and i don't think those have a good hba mode meaning zfs is out and i gotta seriously consider using debian instead sadly 04:51:19 Update on my infinite make install loop thing... I pressed CTRL+C to end the loop because I'm pretty much bored with it now. It stopped, and then started back again. I held CTRL+C down for like 30 seconds and it's still going. 04:51:41 it shows the PS1 prompt and everything 04:52:22 I can even run a "echo howdy" command, it outputs just fine, but then more make-related stuff keeps coming through 04:56:05 And the last bit of intel before I restart this thing... It used 100% of 64GB of ram, and running "top" took like 3 full minutes to open on a TTY. 05:01:10 i don't see how using raid is going to fix a memory problem 05:20:13 well ya it prolly wont rtprio but i'm trying everything before i'm forced off of freebsd and onto linux 05:20:23 you think -current would do better or nah? 05:27:36 why is there always 724 users here 05:33:38 Aubriella: people using bouncers probably 05:34:19 Aventra, yeah, but wouldn't you expect some variance there? 05:34:19 lol 05:34:23 thats a global population 05:34:25 supposedly 05:34:41 whats the variance, it's at least seasonal 05:34:51 with a drawdown of a few people an hour 06:35:47 ya using a 2nd raid array didn't help. back to 100% swap used, swp_pager_getswapspace failed, out of swap space 06:36:11 don't see any way i can stick with freebsd this sucks 06:48:56 Have you read through this? https://man.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?tuning 07:03:59 first sentence recommends 192GB swap, since that's how much ram i have. that seems reasonable to you all? 07:19:11 so i put the raid card into hba mode and did a fresh 14.2 install with auto zfs and mostly defaults, including using local_unbound. but when i boot into system it says error resolving pool 2.freebsd.pool.ntp.org name does not resolve 07:19:24 can't resolve any domains 07:19:42 i selected dhcp settings when installing and i can ping out. i can even ssh in, so i know it has network 07:20:26 i thought the recommendation is double RAM up to 4 GB (so 8 GB swap) but over that one might never need it 07:21:02 'double (of) up to 4 GB RAM' 08:23:10 what's vdev i/o failure mean? zpool=zroot path= offset=137472937984 size=4096 error=5 getting tons of those in /var/log/messages on freebsd 08:32:22 i checked the smartctl output of the drives but i don't know how to interpret it. there are some non-medium errors for each drive fwiw 08:40:08 demido: vdev i/o failure is bad 08:40:35 error 5 is EIO (input/output error) 08:40:51 your hardware (controller, or disks) is failure) 08:41:01 s/failure/faulty/ 08:41:24 drop output of `zroot status -v` here 08:42:35 do you mean zpool? 08:42:44 #facepalm 08:42:45 zroot no command found 08:42:50 `zpool status -v` 08:43:06 demido: aye I just got up, ENOCOFFEE 08:44:23 demido: IIRC the original plan was: 08:44:35 dch https://termbin.com/t5sz 08:44:51 - switch to zfs, because we can then change the memory allocation for caching of the VMS 08:45:22 ya 08:45:27 i can't get a break heh 08:46:32 mfisyspd7p3 is the one with the issue 08:46:41 its a single checksum, a single write failure 08:47:00 how could you tell that's the 1 with the problem? 08:47:09 so do the smartctl checks on this, stash the results somewhere for safekeeping 08:47:29 then we will clear the error flag, run a `zpool scrub zroot` and see what comes up 08:47:46 sorry my copypasting is bad today 08:47:49 mfisyspd5p3 ONLINE 0 435 1 08:47:56 far column 08:48:32 ok ya that's what i thought 08:48:46 so do smartctl check on just that drive and save it? 08:49:10 this entire system is cursed 08:49:22 the WRITE column is *also* an error counter 08:49:51 so every single disk is bad? 08:49:53 mfisyspd1p3 has had 1.03k failures writes 08:50:01 demido: possibly 08:50:08 fuck 08:50:41 its more plausible that this is a RAID card, and the volumes are hardware raid, and zfs is cleaning up issues there. 08:51:03 demido: any more detail on the hardware? 08:51:15 perc 730p in hba mode 08:51:28 do you want me to save the smartctl output for every drivethen do scrub thing? 08:52:14 you should use the mrsas driver in preference here I think 08:52:27 instead of using hba mode? 08:53:34 or use mrsas driver WITH card in hba mode? 08:54:02 no, I need to get some coffee/food first, but mfi driver is old, freebsd 6ish, and mrsas https://man.freebsd.org/mrsas is the newer one freebsd 10 IIRC. 08:54:14 no to which? 08:54:29 my first guess on seeing this is that that h/w card is in some sort of RAIDy mode still 08:54:47 or the card is defective, thats a lot of write errors for a system that you just installed 08:55:22 so we should be aiming for mrsas drivers, using "JBOD" mode. 08:55:33 I'm not sure wht HBA mode is, probably the same thing. 08:55:45 NGL this is a little fiddly 08:56:06 I am not sure I have access anymore to a system where I did this, i'll have a look after breakfast 08:56:08 is it a good sign that i run zpool status -v again and the write and chk numbers aren't higher? 08:56:34 demido: if it can't survive the installer, its going to shit itself under load 08:57:14 well i've installed and configured the 2 vms on it fwiw 08:57:20 overall, you need to add stuff to /boot/loader.conf to tell mfi driver not to connect, and to load the mrsas one too 08:57:57 first lets clear the pool state, `zpool clear zroot` 08:58:10 then `zpool scrub zroot` 08:58:33 you can watch it via `zpool status -v 5` 08:59:08 ok 08:59:15 get that coffee and i'll be here 08:59:36 does the current FreeNAS still use freebsd? 09:01:27 scrub repaired 10M in :38 with 0 errors 09:01:49 in the output it's showing 0's for all write columns, but read and chsum columns have lots of numbers 09:02:06 demido: ok so this is definitely not viable setup then 09:02:59 ok i'll config it to use the mrsas driver then reboot it 09:04:03 that wont IMO fix these errors 09:04:20 damn 09:04:59 I only have notes from a DELL-BOSS system, but we remove all the "virtual disks" in the bios 09:05:25 my best guess so far is (if this is a new system) that the hardware is still in synthetic raid mode somehow 09:05:32 used 09:05:44 and if its not a new system then either controller, or cables, are defective, or not well mounted 09:06:04 sometimes its enough to open the box, wiggle the cards and cables and reseat them 09:06:28 anyway sadly I'm afk for most of the day now, I need to pack & wrangle kids 09:06:31 good luck demido 09:06:41 damn, k ty 09:08:25 once your h/w issues are sorted 09:08:47 `zfs set primarycache=metadata zroot/my/vm` was what we wanted to do, for memory tuning 09:08:50 i dont see how ill fix them 09:09:07 maybe the newer driver is enough 09:16:28 is it true I must delete either KDE6 or XFCE4 (conflicts) to upgrade with pkg? 09:34:12 pretty sure they don't conflict directly, so conflicting dependencies? 09:45:07 yay virt-manager and bhyve 09:45:18 now i just need something better than xrdp 10:41:29 dch im setting the box up from scratch again, taking exact notes, and using mrsas driver. so far so good, no errors anywhere (OMFG?) 11:49:15 dch got the system fully rebuilt and now the vms are downloading data. will take a few hours to finish that part but it's looking great. all zeros in zpool status -v 15, no errors in /var/log/messages 11:49:38 i set `zfs set primarycache=metadata zroot/my/vm` so hopefully the mem issue is worked out now too 12:23:46 in my zfs config, should i enable swap mirroring? i feel like i should since losing the drive with swap on it would take the system down, but is there a downside? like why is it disabled by default? 13:14:19 Hello. Here's the situation: I have a hp proliant g8 server and I have freebsd installed in bay0. but i want to copy the OS into an SD card so i can have an extra drive for the RAID. So i've found the best thing to do is to use an SD Card. what is the best way to copy the operating system from the hard drive to the sd card, considerating the sd card is smaller (1.2b of hard drive vs 128gb of sd 13:14:21 card) 13:14:29 currently the OS is only 3GB. So it's not a big issue 14:04:08 Anyone here at FOSDEM? 14:07:50 unfortunately not for me this year :( 14:07:58 polarian: have fun though :D 14:09:09 Thanks :) 15:24:47 I'm no expert but I 15:25:02 oops 15:26:32 I'm no expert but I can't imagine this is correct.. Everything I try to install through ports keeps wanting to pull in way more dependencies than it seems like it needs. Like why does Bash and porttree and nano need all this python linear algebra stuff? 15:58:53 well, porttree is written in python using "all this python linear algebra stuff" 18:39:10 hello all, i'm asking a question in #freebsd because i am dealing with a descendent that uses y'alls drivers. what is the state of usb ethernet dongles in freebsd? e.g. consumer grade like belkin. in openbsd it's a hot mess, very finicky and unreliable. i'm curious whether freebsd has this ironed out pretty well. (mine appear as ue0 and ue1 but that is all i know) 18:40:04 (i'm at phase where i need to use what i have in the junk drawer or purchase new ones) 18:42:06 to be honest i only have 1 that appear and one that needs modeswitch 18:42:28 the appearing one is untested :/ 18:46:24 * ecbrown bows courteously to ketas for feedback 18:49:35 :p 18:50:26 wifi has fancy improvements tho if you want that 18:51:00 it's really a try-and-see thing but i've been bitten by getting a deluxe network enviroment all set up only to lock up at some stochastically determined time 18:52:21 eh 18:53:01 ketas: i have a little nuc that sits next to router. i'm trying to turn it into a mini-multinic system with pf rdr-to/reply-to to create symmetrical routing 18:53:03 https://forums.freebsd.org/threads/what-is-the-best-usb-ethernet-adapter-driver-free-for-freebsd.85813/ 18:53:10 messy messy messy hmm 18:53:34 ketas: thanks, i'm afraid to read that because i think the answer is discouraging 18:53:38 any chance you can do what i did? 18:53:54 switch 18:54:32 but did you try 18:54:35 switch like network appliance or switch like change dongle 18:55:13 ketas: i have only confirmed that i can get ue0 and ue1 to get dhcp and receive traffic 18:55:36 but the pathologies i have seen are in longer time, like in a day or two it stops working 18:55:37 switch like managed ethernet switch, they appear as second hand items, 1g should be pretty available etc 18:56:20 i'm really at the point of maximal economy and sport to be had from keeping out of landfill 18:56:35 if i really wanted to do this i would but multiple e1000's for example and a new computer 18:57:13 but you had some ethernets around 18:57:15 so i would put $ on switch toward proper solution. but i don't want to spend the money since this current equipment would go in cabinet 18:57:19 what happened? 18:57:37 ketas: wrong form factor, i have a nuc. the ethernets were for a homebuild from 2017 that died 18:58:02 wrong form factor for usb ethernet? 18:58:46 sorry, i have two usb ethernet dongles (ue0) and several network cards (Intel (TM) e1000) but no computer for them 18:59:01 you could connect them to each other with cat5 and flood something through 18:59:10 for a day 18:59:56 i had idea to use them but somehow didn't 18:59:58 indeed. hoping a little check in with #freebsd might help me decide to put weekend into this hack or whether i need to head to microcenter 19:00:44 i bet someone uses them 19:00:58 it *did not* work on openbsd. it would not be an option. i am hoping for different outcome by different driver implementation 19:02:10 all i know is that many of those drivers are been there in fbsd for long time 19:02:18 unsure what it means 19:02:23 either work or not 19:02:25 i hear you 19:02:35 it could be really good and stable or really bad and shitty 19:03:06 forum topic confirmed working of some or so 19:03:08 unsure 19:08:31 ketas: i think i've been here before years ago with pfsense, lan & wan on ue and it was poor experience 19:09:15 so, knowing that drivers areold helps me believe that situation is not changed and i should get new chassis for e1000's 19:10:04 thanks for feedback. i'll keep my eyes peeled for more feedback 19:40:39 ecbrown: when i pointed out weird usb wifi delay/latency/jitter/loss issues to adrian, he was like maybe indeed usb stack itself isn't really that realtime perf that nics need so if your usb eth issues with every card was like this, who knows 19:40:59 also i don't think i'm exactly that good in this at all 19:41:15 but i guess they are rarely used 19:41:19 that's bummer 19:41:45 like e1000 is everywhere, god forbid if it's not working well 19:45:53 well, i have bigger problems too, i have 10 gig available to me. 19:46:10 Hey do you guys think it's possible to run FreeBSD on a 5k iMac with the AMD GPU available? 19:46:22 but i really need to plan my investment. i don't mind spending money but i want it to be what i need 19:48:44 Aventra: https://wiki.freebsd.org/AppleSilicon 19:48:48 did you see this page 19:49:07 no - 'tis an intel imac sorry 19:49:42 then i'd say your chances are good. who knows about wifi, plan on a dongle 19:50:28 my main concerns with it would be fusion drive, wireless(I could use ethernet I suppose), and graphics through the gpu 19:50:37 the best thing to do is try and see with a live stick 19:50:47 Aventra: you will have to break up that fusion drive 19:51:02 or perhaps do a deal with the devil in volume manager 19:51:13 yeah that's fine - I think you can install root partiton to the SSD and use the rest as storage 19:51:32 forget about the spinnning rust 19:51:45 dd target for backing up ssd portion 19:52:36 plug in ssd additional storage and that thing will rock 19:54:25 when i had one i was sooooo glad i got the 128GB 19:58:39 ecbrown: 10g broadband0 19:58:40 ? 19:58:43 i used it so long that the hdd (even unused) developed an audible quack 19:59:01 i had to ditch the computer because i screwed up taking off screen to get at power connector 19:59:12 ketas: yes 19:59:22 might as well use mellanox nics then 19:59:43 they have their own fbsd driver writers 20:00:04 ketas: that's what i'm talking about 20:00:10 (dog) 20:00:20 yes, certified high speed ethernet cards 20:00:48 unsure what netflix uses in their fbsd boxes 20:01:13 at 10g one needs like actual hw too 20:01:37 not those soda straws 20:01:58 yes, this is why i'm migrating from openbsd as well. sometimes it has a hard time keeping up with that speed 20:02:36 i love that os but i have to with what works 20:02:46 s/go with/ 20:44:10 i switched my setup to zfs and it seems to be better, but i have 57G Free yet swap is 46% used? 8G laundry too 21:22:55 memory use it or lose it 21:23:16 if it evicts who cares 21:25:54 i use hammer2 so the memory in use is lower but its only catharsis 21:26:37 ecbrown: I can never find anything about that. Does Hammer2 do self-healing if it has multiple backing disks yet? 21:26:51 no 21:27:05 it is merely a filesystem and not a volume manager 21:27:27 i'm not an expert but i feel like its btrfs or something in capabilties 21:27:46 I thought that was one of the original design goals for Hammer, but I haven't tracked it closely enough. 21:27:59 Was also a design goal for Stratis, but that didn't happen. 21:28:24 iiuc a motivating goal was for "federated kernels and storage" 21:28:35 i am so old that we had something called MOSIX that did this 21:28:56 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MOSIX 21:29:01 but now there is exptl support for mounting remote hammer2 volumes, that is not e.g. nfs 21:29:11 yes, that is my understanding 21:29:29 btw i am not here to litigate for dfly in any way. i love zfs and freebsd 21:30:47 I was just personally curious. 21:30:48 imma now say something controversial, i love ufs and ffs. sometimes i just dont need the extras 21:31:00 heh 21:31:22 ecbrown maybe you didn't read what i said, but swap is being used when i have 57G FREE MEMORY 21:31:39 so what 21:31:59 thats what i wrote to what you wrote 21:32:38 why second guess virtual memory system? 21:32:41 demido: It's not being actively used, is it? 21:32:53 demido: I'd suspect this is from some earlier event. 21:49:46 i would like to ask another topic: i grew up on mvs and so have familiarity with enterprise solutions that are way past what you can get at best buy. how does freebsd + zfs going full tilt compare with e.g. what a IBM Power storage offering provides today? 21:50:18 is it basically comparing infinity to infinity? 21:52:10 (1 petabyte for argument sake) 21:53:14 gcp provides moar :D 21:53:22 ecbrown: I could be wildly wrong, but my understanding is that enterprise storage outside of ZFS or things like OneFS or WAFL you basically have Ceph or Gluster. 21:53:23 there is no ibm these days 21:53:53 wow, did not know any of this landscape. glad i asked 21:54:19 ecbrown: Also, contrary to what you just heard, there's absolutely still IBM and Power in big enterprise. 21:55:02 * ecbrown sighs in relief since he has oracle on power at $work 21:55:07 hah 21:57:47 thank you for discussion, #freebsd. i'm new to your family group and glad i took a spin by. i hope to submit some patches to freebsd-ports that will benefit me downstream. cheers and great afternnoon 22:15:07 mason not being actively used. it's free, not active or inactive or laundry. 57G free. swap is 43% inuse and really shouldn't be with so much free mem 22:15:41 mason but now i'm using zfs, so maybe it'll make it easier for us to figure out why that is? 22:16:36 demido: It won't probably go away without some reason to. Nothing much would be fained. 22:16:39 gained* 22:17:35 seems lame to use swap when there's 57 GIGABYTES of free mem tho 22:26:37 demido: Force it out if you want. swapoff, swapon 22:26:46 But it won't gain anything tangible. 22:27:18 i'll leave it alone i trust your knowledge. can you tell me how to detect when swap usage is BAD though so i can watch for that? 22:28:13 demido: I'd worry about it if you get to where main memory is full. Until then, any use of swap is generally incidental. 22:28:34 ok ty 22:29:01 Sure. And again, I don't know why it decided to dig into swap a bit, or when, and that's certainly a curious thing. 22:29:21 But what's bad about swap usage is that it loads an already busy system with unwanted IO. 22:34:40 look at the swap rate not the fill level 22:34:58 how can i do that? 22:36:49 find a utility that reports page-in-per-second. On Linux it'd be vmstat 22:37:17 q 22:38:09 vmstat 5 is running now 22:38:25 pi/po started at 7/5, then 0's each update since 22:39:02 just got 2 pi, then 1 pi 22:39:56 in my terms, that's as close to idle as to not care about 22:40:27 just got 3 pi 22:40:33 just got 9 pi 22:40:39 still np? 22:40:45 yup 22:40:46 just got 4 pi 22:40:49 ok 22:40:54 what kinda numbers would be worth taking note of? 22:41:10 thousands, depending on your hardware 22:41:20 ah ok great 22:42:00 and in the auto zfs screen of bsdinstall, i'll enable geli encryption, swap encryption, mirror swap, and raid10, with default 2g swap size. any other settings important on that screen? 23:34:46 Does QT make use of the system CA? It doesn't appear to.