01:03:35 Last Feb I had this idea to experiment with freebsd in a vm. April was my first "on metal" install, so it's been roughly a year for me. Thanks to everyone in IRC who's been so helpful. The community is definitely part of the appeal. :) 01:04:40 Carbon666, Usually all installers would have their own boot loader. Meaning that GRUB would need to "chainload" to the next boot loader. And the second boot loader would have the kernel parameters. 01:04:59 But there are multiple ways to do it. Six of one and a half dozen of the other. 01:38:16 markmcb, i'm curious, what do you use your FreeBSD machine for? I am always pestering people about it, so no big deal if you can't share 04:07:28 jauntyd, i've got a 2U rack server in my garage. it's my everything server. several bhyve instances and jails running a wide variety of things sitting on 124 TB raw storage. it just feels so cohesive to me. 04:36:56 markmcb, Only one? It must be so lonely. :-) 05:16:16 rwp: two actually, but the second is only for backup. nothing exciting 08:51:21 rwp, I will be quitting here to try out some menu entries and will let you know if something has worked for me. Have a nice day buddy 12:11:19 hi, hackers! Trying to install wayfire and I got this: eson.build:36:17: ERROR: Dependency "nlohmann_json" not found, tried pkgconfig and cmake 12:14:01 tykling so you have one entry in authorized_keys per server who can access the backup server am i right in this assumption 14:46:16 aldcor: pretty self explanatory error mesage. Try installing whatever nlohmann_json is. 15:51:04 tykling your backup push process: requires my source server to be able to ssh backupuser@backupserver, in the guide you test and zfs allow the backup pool to a user, so im not really sure why you need the authorized_keys beeing set, unless backup server is locked down only for usage of pubkey from what i read 16:02:01 aldcor: try installing devel/nlohmann-json 16:26:19 the handbook (/usr/share/doc/handbook) isn't shipped with the OS anymore, right? 16:44:21 lw, It's an install option with the bsdinstaller. So I think officially that would be optionally available. 16:44:48 rwp: is it still? i don't see the doc set at http://mirrorservice.org/sites/ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/releases/amd64/14.0-RELEASE/ 16:44:50 Title: Index of /sites/ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/releases/amd64/14.0-RELEASE 16:44:53 or does it grab it from somewhere else 16:45:16 12.4 still has doc.txz 16:47:31 I just ran through a 14.0R install yesterday and I recall seeing it there as an installer option. Which I declined as I was installing for a test and throwing it away and didn't need to move more bits around than I needed to move around. 16:47:48 hmm curious 16:48:25 i wish it was easier to just throw an installer ISO at bhyve and say "boot this please", maybe i should check out markjdb's bricoler 16:49:13 * rwp wishes I were more proficient with bhyve, it's a goal of mine 16:53:05 i'm pretty good at vm-bhyve now but stock bhyve is really not super user friendly with all the 'stock' options you need to pass 16:53:17 qemu isn't great here either but it is a bit easier to just boot a new VM from a disk image / cdrom 18:32:31 isn't it weird that /etc/rc.d/swap runs before /etc/rc.d/savecore? 18:35:49 i wonder if this is what's causing my crashing system to not create dumps from savecore 18:36:27 hm, i guess this is documented in fstab(5) which tells you to use the 'late' option on swap devices 18:38:09 * lw adds a separate dump partition to be sure 18:41:52 apparently the specific problem here is that as soon as you add a swap device, if it's on an SSD, swapon immediately sends a TRIM to erase the entire storage 18:42:01 so it erases the dump even if nothing has swapped out yet 18:43:21 Oh, you have the trimonce option? 18:43:53 ah, no, i don't. so maybe it's not that 18:44:37 if using a dedicated dump device doesn't fix it, i'll go run poudriere on the system console and see what the problem is (poudriere seems to reliably trigger the crash) 18:50:36 hi folks :) I'm having some trouble getting the sfp+ nics working, wasa hoping to get some help/pointers, although it is opnsense, I do not seem to be able to get the sfp+ to recognize the plugged in cables 18:50:55 collected some info here https://forum.opnsense.org/index.php?topic=40087.msg196570#msg196570 18:50:56 Title: Odido ISP Netherlands Connection Guide 18:51:56 am new new to *bsd world, familiar with linux though 18:52:34 funkymon1ey: did you remove the SFP+ from the ONT and put it in your freebsd machine? in most cases, this won't work, as PON needs encryption configured on the fibre 18:59:04 i'm not sure what you mean by 'modem' in that post as FTTP/PON shouldn't involved a modem, just the ONT and a router 19:04:03 lw no, atm the pon is not going into the freebsd machine, just trying to get sfp+ ports fowrking 19:04:17 directly pc to pc lan 19:06:01 so the ISP isn't involved at all, you just connected two computers together? via DAC? 19:07:40 so I got my internet speed upgraded from 1 to 8gb and eventually want to have th epon connected to the baremetal but I noticed i get no carrier on the sfp+ ports soo thought let's first try to get something simple working pc to pc lan 19:08:23 tbh it's hard to understand your actual configuration / problem from your forum post, could you describe exactly what you're connected/configured, and what doesn't work? 19:09:25 main issue is what ever i do, ifconfig shows "status: no carrier" 19:09:46 which i think it means it does not see the plugged in cables? 19:09:55 does it show no carrier on both sides of the link? 19:10:02 no, only on bsd 19:10:09 link comes up on Linux side? 19:10:13 on linux it shows link deteced 19:10:20 that's strange 19:10:29 yes 19:11:55 did you try both SFP cages on BSD side? 19:12:10 yes 19:12:24 same result 19:13:45 you might try 'ifconfig ax0 media 10Gbase-Twinax' although i will be surprised if that makes a difference 19:15:15 that returns: ifconfig: SIOCSIFMEDIA (media): Device not configured 19:17:11 funkymon1ey: what about sysctl -w dev.ax.0.link_workaround=1 ? 19:18:02 that returns: dev.ax.0.link_workaround: 1 -> 1 19:18:18 does the link come up? if not, try setting it to 0 then back to 1 19:19:32 does not come up, tried setting to 0 then back to 1, same result 19:19:59 ok, i'm out of ideas then, perhaps this is a driver bug... do you have anything else you can try in the same port, like a pair of fibre SFPs? 19:21:51 funkymon1ey: you may try booting FreeBSD 14.0 install media (you don't have to install it) and see if the link comes up there, just to rule out opnsense-specific issue. if it still doesn't work, you could ask rajesh1.kumar⊙ac who is listed as driver maintainer in axp(4) 19:22:09 lw: many thanks in any case for your efforts, atm no other cables here to try 19:22:26 thank you also for that :) 19:22:39 will try with live medium 19:24:58 it is strange that link comes up on the linux side, this is what makes me think it is a driver bug, for some reason freebsd doesn't notice the chip has link up state 19:25:24 funkymon1ey: just ooi did you try running tcpdump on ax0 to see if it's actually passing traffic even if ifconfig says no carrier? 19:25:56 (that shouldn't be possible, but...) 19:30:04 lw no i didn't try that yet, but just did, here the output https://pastebin.com/atpnfNU4 19:30:06 Title: tcpdump --interface ax0tcpdump: verbose output suppressed, use -v or -vv for f - Pastebin.com 19:30:19 there seems to be some stuff coming in? 19:36:04 * funkymon1ey ponders 19:36:22 funkymon1ey: yes - try running ping from the linux side and see if the incoming icmp shows up in tcpdump? 19:36:47 i tried that is in the output on pastebin 19:38:38 though linux shows 100% packet loss and destination host unreachable 19:39:01 lw 19:39:04 ok, so if 10.133.120.3 is the linux side, there is traffic arriving there from that IP address, but no icmp pings 19:39:37 lw, I'm dealing with a CMake project that is trying to do things with something called "python site package path". what is that and how do I configure/set that on FreeBSD? 19:39:42 that suggests issue might be on the linux side, maybe wrong routing table or firewall? does tcpdump on linux show the icmp packets exiting right interface? 19:40:40 jbo: uhh i'm not sure, i've never dealt with python in cmake. what exactly is it doing? 19:40:53 ah maybe i configured linux not correctly, will try tcpdump on linux 19:41:18 jbo: python site package path is usually /usr/local/lib/python3.XX/site-packages/ 19:41:56 lw, https://gitlab.com/kicad/code/kicad/-/blob/master/CMakeLists.txt?ref_type=heads#L920 19:41:58 Title: CMakeLists.txt · master · KiCad / KiCad Source Code / kicad · GitLab 19:41:58 lw, https://gitlab.com/kicad/code/kicad/-/blob/master/cmake/FindwxPython.cmake?ref_type=heads#L34 19:42:00 Title: cmake/FindwxPython.cmake · master · KiCad / KiCad Source Code / kicad · GitLab 19:42:45 jbo: so it looks like it's trying to autodetect this from python binary, does it get the wrong value? 19:43:26 lw, I'm not too sure. I'm hacking around things. Right now it's failing at FindwxPython.cmake line 66 19:43:36 lw thx there is def. some funky shizzle going on here on the linux side 19:43:38 Unknown wxPython/Phoenix version string: 19:43:51 jbo: i am not the person to ask about this, sorry :-( 19:43:53 will figure that one out and see if that resolves the issue, many thanks :) 19:43:59 lw, alright, thanks :) 19:44:13 jbo: you have wxpython installed right? 19:44:29 lw, jup. py311-wxPython42-4.2.0_1 19:44:36 funkymon1ey: you should at least file a bug at bugs.freebsd.org if you can reproduce this with upstream freebsd since if the link is working it should not say no carrier 19:44:47 funkymon1ey: correct output is something like media: Ethernet autoselect (10Gbase-Twinax ) 19:45:14 (that's from ix, but ax should work the same way) 19:45:46 jbo: i suggest some printf debugging in the cmakefiles: https://cmake.org/cmake/help/latest/command/message.html -- see what the variables are getting set to 19:45:47 Title: message — CMake 3.29.2 Documentation 19:47:26 wow, des@ is pretty... let's say "short" 19:48:09 body shaming alert :o 20:01:15 lw, is there a difference in python stuff from FreeBSD ports to Linux distors? i.e. is it possible that it's looking for 'python' but my executable is called 'python3.11' instead? 20:01:52 jbo: you should have 'python', if not, install lang/python 20:01:56 uskerine, I am curious if your firefox simply consumed all available memory. It does that here sometimes. 20:02:09 jbo: also install lang/python3 to get 'python3' 20:02:21 lw, hmm yeah I only have /usr/local/bin/python3.11 nothing else 20:02:29 well, python3.11-config but that's it 20:02:50 different systems handle how to get python{,3} symlinks different ways but freebsd way is to install lang/python, lang/python3 20:03:15 my repo doesn't even have that 20:03:21 you must build it! 20:03:31 I have lang/python311 20:03:34 it won't take long, it's literally just a couple of symlinks and a dependency on lang/python311 20:04:39 lw, alright, thank you! 20:04:40 good info 20:05:06 how come every other time I have a shit day it's something python 20:05:42 because [censored] [censored] freebsd [censored] python [censored] 20:08:13 gesundheit 20:08:54 Creating repository in /tmp/packages: 5% 20:08:56 yay 20:15:15 Creating repository in /tmp/packages: 71% 20:15:16 q__q 20:21:23 i've always been dubious about that /tmp/packages thing, i wonder how securely it creates that directory 20:30:43 wondering if I can see which bluetooths are available and pair one (I am trying to connect my bluetooth headsets to my Jabra Link 380 -usb bluetooth-) 20:31:05 rwp> yes I am lately having issues with firefox being slow 20:31:18 I see too many processes around and a lot of memory taken 20:33:15 jbo: did that fix it or are you still creating repository 20:36:10 uskerine, If you are not using uBlock Origin then I would recommend installing it as that will reduce memory requirements and provide for better security too. 20:40:07 rwp> what is ublock origin 20:40:31 lw, do I want to install lang/python or just lang/pyton3 ? 20:40:33 https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/ublock-origin/ 20:40:35 Title: uBlock Origin – Get this Extension for 🦊 Firefox (en-US) 20:40:36 jbo: both 20:40:50 jbo: lang/python bestows /usr/local/bin/python, lang/python3 bestows /usr/local/bin/python3 20:41:11 uskerine ^^ what lw posted, +1 20:41:44 lw, now it works <3 20:41:45 thanks! 20:41:55 jbo: awesome, i'll send the invoice later 20:41:58 I see it 20:42:56 regarding the pairing USB dongle, I guess that is not easy, right? 20:45:31 * rwp knows nothing about Bluetooth 21:09:15 [140Ramd64-main] Fetching texlive-texmf-20230313.pkg: 23% 281 MiB 9.1MB/s 01:54 ETA 21:09:18 the gift that keeps on giving 21:10:20 i wish -b latest worked with pkgbase 21:17:18 jbo: why do you only get 9.1MB/s, does your fancy new motherboard only have a 100Mbps port? 21:17:30 ask upstream dist infra 21:19:36 wait what 21:19:40 why do all my speedtests say 100mbps 21:33:05 lw, did you not provide a git-format patch intentionally? 21:33:13 jbo: where? 21:33:22 https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=276996 21:33:24 Title: 276996 – [NEW PORT] databases/postgres_exporter: PostgreSQL metric exporter for Prometheus 21:33:43 i probably forgot, you can just commit it as you, i don't mind 21:33:50 unless you want me to make a new one 21:33:57 nah, I can set the author field manually 21:34:04 keep in mind that this needs to go through review first - on that now 21:35:03 i will not keep that in mind 21:35:11 how care you tell me what i should keep in my mind 21:35:16 s/care/dare 21:37:31 * jbo throws a CPU at lq 21:37:33 lw* 21:37:45 thanks! can i have the motherboard too? 21:38:19 so needy 21:44:17 lw, should the rc script maybe match the package name w.r.t. prometheus? 21:44:54 jbo: i prefer it matches the binary name, i think this is more correct 21:45:03 lw, reasonable argument 21:57:12 for some reason sublime-music has stopped playing music... 21:57:53 ValueError: ('Invalid value for mpv parameter', -4, (, , )) 21:59:34 why can't there be a music player that just works and isn't awful :-/ 22:00:32 what's wrong with cmus? 22:00:52 flatdog: i don't remember but something about how it does ncurses stuff made it unusable for me 22:00:59 like it didn't highlight stuff properly or something 22:01:30 musikcube has a nicer interface than cmus but just randomly doesn't play some tracks and development seems dead 22:01:40 using the web interface of navidrome for now... 22:02:35 I see. Well, cmus works well for me, I must be one of the lucky ones :) 22:02:44 *no pun 22:03:01 although musikcube doesn't support multi-disc albums properly either which is annoying 22:08:51 jbo: how do i run poudriere with rctl to stop it munching all cpus? 22:11:15 lw, AFAIK a reasonable approach is to run poudriere itself in a jail, then racct on that jail 22:11:27 you'll need to allow the poudriere jail to spawn sub-jails and ZFS access tho 22:11:29 that sounds like a nightmare with getting the zfs into the jail 22:11:34 i never got that to work 22:11:54 I know one of my mentors does that - I haven't bothered to set that up myself. I just upgraded hw 22:12:08 yeah yeah yeah 22:12:50 duckduckgoing for "poudriere rctl" is not really returning anything useful 22:13:09 i wish we had something like Solaris projects, that would make this easier 22:13:35 maybe i can do something similar with login classes 22:14:06 (solaris had a really neat thing where you could do fair-share cpu timeslice allocation between projects... used to use that on a multi-user hosting system) 22:16:03 that sounds nice 22:16:32 it was... i'd really like to bring a few Solaris features over to FreeBSD (contracts!) but it's a lot of work 22:16:44 i think we could do contracts via 'null jails' 22:16:56 I'm looking forward to it :) 22:17:15 don't expect anything too soon, i'm fixing pkgbase first, that's a big job 22:17:56 if we had contracts though we could do something like systemd except not terrible (i.e., Solaris SMF) 22:18:24 lw: there are no null jails… i wish we could port contracts over 22:18:49 meena: i know, i just mean if we did have null jails that seems like a good way to do it 22:18:50 is solaris officially dead or... ? 22:18:59 in solaris 'zones' and 'contracts' were separate things but i don't think they need to be 22:19:04 jbo: no, it's still around 22:19:13 why talking about it in past tense then? 22:19:17 opensolaris is dead 22:19:27 lw: i think it's nice that they are orthogonal 22:19:42 jbo: well, solaris and opensolaris are pretty dead 22:19:46 meena: hmm 22:20:01 i think these days, it's primarily Illumos that lives on 22:20:28 well, solaris maybe isn't dead, just dead to me lol 22:20:33 jbo: it's in the past tense for me because new Oracle licensing means i have no interest in using it 22:20:55 ... which is basically why i'm in #freebsd now 22:21:04 if oracle hadn't bought sun i'd probably be happy using opensolaris 22:21:56 * meena thinks about that for a while 22:22:24 hrm… i think i'd still be with FreeBSD, unless opensolaris was easier to install lol 22:23:28 * jbo had an oracle person at their office last week 22:23:51 * jbo spoke a lot of oracle jokes 22:24:17 meena: what did you think of my modset idea 22:24:25 i'm not conviced devmatch solves this, despite what imp says 22:24:30 not all modules are device drivers 22:25:29 lw, does std::filesystem::is_regular_file imply std::filesystem::exists ? 22:25:39 jbo: i have literally no idea 22:25:49 i don't really see how it couldn't though 22:25:55 can't be a file if it doesn't exist, right 22:26:11 yeah, that would be my line of thinking too, but I don't know all the possible edge cases 22:27:11 lw: i'm still mulling over it. I'm probably kinda stumped with Apache httpd's all/few/most/none/reallyall 22:27:29 meena: that doesn't really sound like the good solution 22:27:39 who would want 'few' modules instead of 'all'? :-) 22:28:04 devices should work with devmatch, and that should be improved; but I think modulesets should be grouped on purpose, and those might be overlapping 22:28:29 i'm thinking of stuff like if_wg can never be loaded with devmatch because it's not a device 22:28:41 i guess rc.d maybe autoloads it in that particular case 22:28:54 yupp 22:29:19 all if_ stuff is autoloaded, IIRC, tho sometimes you need to preload them, or you're ending up with wonky behaviour 22:29:48 wonder if efirt and aesni gets autoloaded 22:29:51 if_bridge needs to be preloaded, if you want the bridge to copy the device mac, which is influenced by a sysctl 22:30:17 we do need to do something for block drivers like ahci, and filesystems... filesystems should be fairly easy but i'm not sure how to handle storage drivers 22:32:01 i think a good start would be a standard modset including ahci, nvme, nda, etc 22:32:13 then we could switch to MINIMAL as the default kernel (if the filesystem thing is fixed) 22:34:44 could even get this in for 15.0 we if hurry 22:37:27 2 years? 22:37:43 do you think that's too long or not long enough? 22:37:50 i anticipate a lot of bikeshedding 22:38:36 yeah, right, so maybe that's hopefully long enough 22:40:39 we should probably rename it to MODULAR first though 22:41:32 maybe i'll ask arch@ about that, my last few posts went fairly well (got my mailwrapper PR committed) 22:47:27 yeah, that was somewhat surprising 22:47:58 i was not too surprised as my PR was clearly correct :-d but yes, we might have expected more people to object 22:48:34 i might ask imp before asking arch, i know he had some opinions on MINIMAL/MODULAR/whatever 22:48:51 i feel bad about asking him things since he commits all my PRs but this seems like an unrelated thing 22:49:15 I like MODULAR. 22:49:41 it's a much better than name than MINIMAL, which has very different implications 22:49:56 i agree, i remember there was some confusiong about your VIMAGE change because of that 22:50:13 confusion 22:51:17 but, yeah, i think we need an arm64 version first, before we can proceed making it the default 22:51:21 otoh: mv sys/amd64/conf/MINIMAL sys/amd64/conf/GENERIC; git commit -am "amd64: fix kernel configs" 22:51:57 meena: my aim is to be able to boot either amd64 or arm64 without needing anything in loader.conf 22:52:04 which is quite a bit of work, i think 22:52:40 i think i understand the reasoning, but can you still explain why? 22:52:48 i mean the loader.conf part 22:53:41 well imagine i'm a new user, i install freebsd on my desktop, it doesn't boot because nvme_load=YES or ahci_load=YES is missing from loader.conf 22:54:01 we can't make MINIMAL default without fixing this 22:54:04 right now, if i setup a machine with ZFS, my loader.conf looks like this: https://gist.github.com/igalic/c755cdb472f1858fccb3348713d6864f and i didn't do anything for that 22:54:05 Title: gist:c755cdb472f1858fccb3348713d6864f · GitHub 22:54:31 meena: how do you load the driver for your disks? 22:55:02 but: If MINIMAL, or, MODULAR being default, means that it is also the default kernel on an installer ISO, and that means those need to boot, too 22:55:17 right, so this has to be done in loader(8) somehow 22:55:25 not just in devmatch/devd 22:55:29 lw: this is a virtual machine, and the virtio stuff is all built in 22:55:40 ah yeah, but it shouldn't be. and it's not for physical hosts 22:55:52 eggsagtly 22:56:04 (i removed virtio* from my local kernel config) 22:56:10 so, we need to fix quite a bit 22:56:26 i think all the info we need is in loader.hints, right? we can probe pci bus and load all relevant modules 22:56:40 this is more complex though, i thought modsets might be a useful stopgap approach 22:56:48 that's what devmatch does 22:57:05 right, but devmatch doesn't run at boot loader time, it can't load boot device modules 22:57:15 yeah, i'm a bit slow here 22:57:34 i did 1.5h on my bike today, after getting the tyres fixed 22:57:45 *after fixing the tyres 22:57:54 it's a bit more complicated too for e.g. Xen which doesn't use PCI 22:59:16 what does it use? 22:59:31 'xenbus' 22:59:48 xn0: at device/vif/0 on xenbusb_front0 22:59:52 xbd1: 1536000MB at device/vbd/51728 on xenbusb_front0 23:00:25 i have zero idea how this works, i just load the modules in loader.conf 23:00:57 or actually i think i compiled them into the kernel here, 'options XEN' includes all the drivers 23:01:04 (which is also wrong but ...) 23:02:06 lw: EHeM in #bsdmips knows Xen, so you can ask them 23:02:32 i'm ignoring xen for now, i want to make this work on at least amd64/arm64 physical hardware and kvm 23:03:00 unless anyone has a better idea i'm going to hack up a PoC for my loader(8) modsets proposal 23:03:24 that would at least let us make MINIMAL/MODULAR the default kernel today 23:04:31 if we find a way for loader to use PNP hints we can start moving things out of modsets 23:04:58 i need to let that modsets idea simmer for a bit more, or you write up an email to arch@ where you detail your current thoughts and goals, because, as-is, it's too vague for me to not just make up some nonsense 23:05:13 anyway, time to bring doggo out and head to bed 23:05:17 yeah, i think it's easier to demonstrate in code though 23:05:19 nn 23:06:06 O_o 23:06:18 why write words when you can write C 23:06:30 i'm hoping it's C and not Forth 23:06:52 forth is dead, long live Lua 23:07:05 but if Lua doesn't have the bindings yet, then C it is. 23:12:14 maybe i will mail arch@ first though, at least just to find out if anyone else is working on this 23:12:57 welcome front kananter 23:13:12 lw: see here, https://hackmd.io/@jhb/ByWrxQmr2 23:13:13 Title: FreeBSD 15.0 Planning - HackMD 23:14:36 meena: what am i looking for here? 23:15:14 lw: "Boot loader support for devmatch" 23:15:21 ah 23:15:26 (i think) 23:15:39 that's useful but i don't think it fixes this problem as not everything is in devmatch 23:16:36 no, but it's a start 23:16:58 yeah, but i'm worried we'll get tied for 10 years with "we can't switch to MINIMAL because not everything is in devmatch yet" 23:17:38 we've been there already for 10 years 23:17:42 also when i had this discussion with imp@ earlier he seemed to be under the impression that we don't need devmatch in loader since it's in userland... 23:17:54 meena: right, i can't fix the past but i'd like to fix the next 10 years :-) 23:19:12 design rolls 23:26:44 'netlink for ZFS' what 23:27:43 hmm, i wonder how much i trust zfs raidz device removal in -current 23:28:36 or did that not get committed in the end? can't find it in the manpage now 23:32:48 ah, it was zpool attach for raidz that got merged