00:00:20 <edenist> I have all of my wifi setup effectively the same.
00:00:38 <edenist> ISPs put such weird constraints on things
00:01:05 <amigan> but there's not enough ipv6 address space!
00:06:54 <edenist> Think of those poor neutrinos coming from the sun who will be forced to use NAT!
00:20:41 <amigan> edenist: hahaha
00:49:53 <tm512> hmm, bit concerned that the linuxulator-steam-utils readme just mentions to forget about anything working properly on an AMD GPU
01:30:33 <tm512> so iwm doesn't seem to reliably associate with my wireless network, not sure how to troubleshoot this
01:40:49 <edenist> is this on the new laptop?
01:43:19 <tm512> yeah, the T495
01:44:15 <tm512> I'm gonna see if the scan_ssid=1 bit that bsdinstall put in the network block has anything to do with it having trouble, because I've never had that flag set on anything else
01:46:19 <tm512> also, update from yesterday, I have just decided to go the whole fresh installation route instead of just trying to clone the install
01:46:34 <tm512> I'll just end up cloning over my home directory, I think
01:51:04 <edenist> if you've got customizations based on hardware sounds like a sane way to do it. will thank yourself in the future, heh
01:54:03 <tm512> well if I cloned the install, I think the main things I'd have to change is loading amdgpu instead of i915, and disabling wifibox to use native wifi instead
01:54:19 <tm512> also disabling coretemp in favor of amdtemp
01:55:01 <tm512> but doing a fresh install means this hasn't been touched by pkgbase which gives me the opportunity to rethink whether or not I want to continue using that
01:55:40 <tm512> compiling kernel + world on this Ryzen 5 PRO 3500U should be a lot less painful than it would be on the i3-10110U of the other ThinkPad
01:58:38 <edenist> my two desktop/laptop installs are using sandybridge/ivybridge, so I'm definitely not doing world fast on those, lol
02:00:05 <tm512> I remember not having much trouble with either world or kernel on my ivybridge i3 back in the 10-STABLE and 11-STABLE days, but it sounds like LLVM/clang has bloated considerably
02:32:37 <thegman> i cant get ethernet to work
02:32:42 <thegman> or wifi for that matter
02:33:04 <thegman> its loading the drivers as far as i know but it cant find em0
02:33:06 <thegman> only igb0
02:33:19 <thegman> and when i try to use igb0 it says something to the effect of "no link"
02:33:44 <CCFL_Man> thegman: you should use supported hardware
02:34:24 <thegman> i dont know what the name is of this specific ethernet hardware
02:34:28 <thegman> il check
02:34:30 <CCFL_Man> if you want specific hardware support, contribute it
02:35:00 <thegman> is there no support for the "Intel Corperation I211 (rev 03)"
02:35:35 <thegman> i thought that was in the em driver
03:21:22 <thegman> https://www.freebsd.org/releases/14.0R/hardware/ according to this the i211 gigabit ethernet controller is supported
03:21:23 <VimDiesel> Title: FreeBSD 14.0 Hardware Notes | The FreeBSD Project
03:22:33 <concussious> em(4) does support i211 and anecdotally it works on my apu2
03:24:13 <concussious> "ifconfig em0" shows nothing?
03:24:24 <thegman> im pretty sure i tried that
03:25:03 <thegman> if memory serves ifconfig without any arguments shows igb0 and lo
03:25:26 <concussious> do you have something weird in your rc.conf?
03:25:39 <thegman> its a fresh install
03:25:47 <concussious> wait, my bad,
03:25:57 <thegman> but i think i did set the boot delay in there
03:26:21 <concussious> boot delay is a loader.conf, iirc. "dmesg | grep em0"?
03:26:29 <thegman> it was also doing this when i went into a live shell from a usb
03:26:32 <thegman> i guess it was in loader.conf
03:26:39 <thegman> im still new to all the configuration files
03:27:41 <thegman> i saved the output of dmesg and put it in /
03:27:41 <concussious> those are basically the main ones I think for this kind of problem.
03:27:57 <thegman> but i cant get zfs to show me the file so i might have to reboot to re acquire it
03:28:14 <concussious> root can use dmesg command at any time
03:28:25 <thegman> i know but im not booted into freebsd right now
03:28:27 <thegman> its on a dual boot
03:29:28 <thegman> nevermind i got it to work
03:29:41 <concussious> what was wrong with it?
03:29:45 <thegman> grep -i em0 dmesg.log shows nothing
03:29:58 <thegman> i mean i got zfs to import the pool correctly so i could get the log file
03:30:57 <concussious> wow, that's amazing. from my experience, if supported hardware doesn't show up in dmesg, the controller is physically dead.
03:31:14 <thegman> i dont know how it could be dead
03:31:18 <thegman> im using it right now
03:31:36 <thegman> and ive only had this motherboard for around 3 years
03:31:39 <concussious> that's why I'm amazed, obviously not dead
03:35:02 <concussious> "grep 211"?
03:35:16 <thegman> igb0: <Intel(R) I211 (Copper)> port 0xd000-0xd01f mem 0xfc600000-0xfc61ffff,0xfc620000-0xfc623fff at device 0.0 on pci6
03:35:24 <thegman> thats the only line with that
03:36:35 <concussious> okay, so, igb(4) is using your I211, and igb0 is what you want to be configuring
03:37:06 <thegman> when i was using the installer dhcp wouldnt work with igb0
03:37:34 <thegman> i tried to do it manually but whenever i put in the router as 192.168.1.1 it just resets the value i put in there
03:38:24 <concussious> what is the output of "dhclient igb0"? that should get you where you want to go. if your router expects dhcp then you need to use that.
03:39:38 <thegman> ok il boot into freebsd to check
03:45:05 <thegman> output of ifconfig igb0 is on https://bpa.st/OA5Q
03:45:06 <VimDiesel> Title: View paste OA5Q
03:47:28 <concussious> perfect, hit it with a "dhclient igb0"
03:49:04 <thegman> i think the last time i did that it said "no link........."
03:49:25 <concussious> how do the lights on the nic look?
03:50:13 <thegman> isnt that just the led next to the spot the ethernet cable goes in
03:50:19 <concussious> yes, there are two of them
03:50:29 <concussious> theres a orange and a green one
03:50:35 <thegman> one of them is orange
03:50:41 <thegman> the other one is flashing green every now and then
03:51:04 <concussious> sounds about right
03:51:44 <concussious> so, when everything sounds about right, but it still won't work, I use "service netif restart".
03:53:13 <thegman> il try that
03:53:56 <concussious> you know, I just realized he can't have the same inet and broadcast
03:59:52 <thegman> restarting netif didnt work
04:02:45 <concussious> my fault, I realized after a moment that you can't have the same inet and broadcast.
04:03:23 <concussious> so, I am now thinking you should "ifconfig igb0 delete" to remove the addresses it thinks it has
04:03:42 <concussious> and if rc.conf is putting those addresses there, you should remove that
04:04:16 <concussious> once you don't have those crazy addresses in there, "dhclient igb0" is how you ask for a dhcp lease on igb0
04:04:51 <thegman> right now rc.conf has ifconfig_igb0="inet 192.168.1.17 netmask 0xffffffff"
04:05:02 <thegman> and defaultrouter="192.168.1.1"
04:05:12 <concussious> that is what is causing your problem
04:05:23 <concussious> you cannot have that and have dhcp, they're trying to do the same thing
04:05:34 <thegman> i set it manually since dhcp wasnt working in the installer
04:05:47 <thegman> it said it could not acquire a dhcp lease
04:06:07 <concussious> is that configuration working?
04:06:25 <thegman> the one in rc.conf you mean
04:06:37 <thegman> thats just what ive had since installing it
04:06:38 <concussious> yes
04:06:45 <concussious> did it work when you installed it?
04:06:49 <thegman> nope
04:07:03 <thegman> internet hasent worked in the installer or after installing it or in a live shell
04:07:16 <concussious> that makes sense. I am under the impression that you have to use dhcp if that's what the router expects.
04:07:44 <thegman> i have noticed spectrum doesnt play nice without dhcp
04:07:50 <thegman> come to think of it it never plays nice
04:08:20 <concussious> honestly man, I use usb tethering. I've lived alone for nine years and never wanted to pay them for their garbage
04:08:29 <concussious> never paid them a penny
04:08:37 <thegman> i dont pay them either its just the internet im stuck with
04:08:53 <thegman> if i had a choice in this matter it would be literally anything except for spectrum
04:09:09 <thegman> they dont even let you do port forwarding from a browser
04:09:19 <thegman> you have to install their gosh dang phone app
04:09:21 <concussious> well, when I go elsewhere, dhclient works if I'm not trying to do something else
04:09:39 <concussious> having addresses specified in rc.conf is trying to do something else
04:09:58 <thegman> should i just not do anything related to ifconfig in rc.conf
04:10:35 <concussious> I don't, except wifi, because I'm always doing different stuff wherever I am
04:11:06 <thegman> il see what happens after i comment out all the ifconfig lines
04:11:13 <concussious> you can say "ifconfig_em0="DHCP"" in rc.conf if you want
04:11:27 <thegman> ok il try that then
04:11:30 <concussious> but I would get it working with nothing in there first and then add that once you're sure it works
04:11:52 <thegman> ok
04:19:48 <thegman> i tried it with and without ifconfig_em0="DHCP"
04:19:55 <thegman> and i tried doing ifconfig igb0 delete
04:20:55 <thegman> didnt work
04:21:04 <concussious> what did "ifconfig igb0" say?
04:21:34 <thegman> the same thing im pretty sure
04:21:48 <thegman> actually
04:22:07 <thegman> when i removed those lines and when i was trying the DHCP thing i think it just didnt have any information about the ip in it
04:22:16 <concussious> also, you can use your phone browser to get on this channel at web.libera.chat
04:22:31 <concussious> so you don't have to keep rebooting
04:22:51 <thegman> il see if theres a phone available
04:22:53 <concussious> it needs to not have the addresses in it to get a dhcp lease
04:25:03 <thegman> the phone thing doesnt want to comply
04:25:33 <concussious> it's also possible that the daemons don't like you
04:25:42 <thegman> that is a possibility
04:25:58 <concussious> sometimes nothing works, and sometimes it's like, did benevolent hackers upgrade my csh configuration?
04:26:11 <thegman> apparently i cant join #freebsd on web.libera.chat without registration
04:26:25 <jmnbtslsQE> if it says no carrier it's a physical problem
04:26:45 <thegman> the only thing i can think of is the ethernet cable being in the wrong slot
04:26:46 <jmnbtslsQE> or some other problem, not having to do with addresses
04:26:53 <thegman> and i dont see how that could happen since im talking on irc right now
04:27:08 <concussious> he's saying it works when he boots to $otheros
04:27:33 <jmnbtslsQE> dunno
04:29:30 <concussious> I think I can figure out out. I think that igb0 is his interface, and as long as nothing is trying to specify an alternative and conflicting configuration, dhclient will work.
04:29:59 <concussious> and we've established that rc.conf is, in fact, specifying an alternative and conflicting configuration
04:30:20 <thegman> but i cleared all network stuff from rc.conf and it still didnt work (after a reboot)
04:30:54 <concussious> well, we've made some progress and I still have hope
04:31:09 <jmnbtslsQE> as far as i know, no carrier always indicates the lack of any link, so at a layer below any addressing
04:31:31 <concussious> that's very good information
04:34:16 <thegman> il try dhcp again
04:34:32 <thegman> but i think it doesnt know about the router
04:34:55 <thegman> is there something i should set in /etc/rc.conf to make it actually use the router
04:35:08 <concussious> the green light means it is talking to the router
04:35:28 <thegman> i know but it doesnt appear to actually talk to the router when im on freebsd
04:35:49 <concussious> I think dhclient will work if nothing else is going on
04:46:07 <thegman> wow
04:46:40 <thegman> i was testing in the livecd and dhclient worked when i switched the slot the ethernet cable was using
04:46:54 <thegman> the strange thing is that slot doesnt work here on gentoo linux
04:48:46 <concussious> the other slot is igb1?
04:48:46 <jmnbtslsQE> if you're judging "works/doesn't work" based on internet access, your internet access is separate from whether the interface has a link
04:49:02 <jmnbtslsQE> you can have an interface with a link but with wrong config and you won't have access
04:49:20 <thegman> i dont see how i would have misconfigured it in this case
04:49:25 <thegman> i just booted into the livecd
04:49:38 <thegman> im assuming theres something i was supposed to do that i didnt know about
04:50:43 <thegman> im pretty sure the other slot is for lan or something like that
04:50:47 <thegman> i dont know all that much about networking
04:50:59 <thegman> but theres a picture of a box with a line going out to 2 more boxes on that one
04:53:41 <thegman> the motherboard manual identifies that as "LAN2"
04:56:09 <concussious> savages, numbers start at 0
04:56:42 <thegman> apparently the fools at asus dont know that
04:57:32 <concussious> actually i suspect those guys are smarter than me, just being silly
04:59:01 <thegman> i would respect them more if they didnt have that "armory crate" download button in their bios
05:01:27 <concussious> i really believe seabios is a thousand years ahead of any efi implementation in simplicity, maintainability, reliability and security
05:02:18 <concussious> i grit my teeth when i see "legacy bios" written, because they have a 16-bit bios implementation that can start massive amounts of cores, nvme storage, gpus, everything.
05:02:48 <concussious> and it has no application interface to run malware on, no network interfaces to even attack in the first place
05:03:38 <thegman> i was considering installing a non garbage bios on this motherboard but i dont know if this one is supported
05:03:47 <thegman> and id probably end up bricking the motherboard
05:03:54 <concussious> also seabios is instant and you cant argue with that
05:05:21 <concussious> im not qualified to port something like that, so i only buy hardware where someone else is maintaining it
05:09:10 <thegman> maybe this is why ethernet wasnt working
05:09:16 <thegman> according to the asus website
05:09:35 <thegman> it lists "Realtek RTL8125-CG 2.5G LAN" then "Intel I211-AT"
05:09:51 <thegman> and it says 2.5G on the slot that wasnt working on freebsd
05:10:00 <thegman> so i guess i shoulda been using re0
05:10:03 <thegman> then again re0 wasnt showing up
05:15:07 <concussious> wow thats what jmnbtslsQE was hinting at, there was no link because that was the wrong interface
05:15:27 <concussious> hardware issue
05:15:38 <concussious> well, link issue
05:16:03 <thegman> either way il work on it tomorrow
05:52:20 <tm512> so if I want /tmp to be tmpfs, but ZFS has zroot/tmp set to mount to /tmp, would ZFS override a tmpfs mount if I add it to fstab? like would I have to delete the ZFS dataset?
05:53:05 <concussious> or you could just unset the property
06:03:19 <Grell> Hello, I am trying to run a program from an account that I have logged into after logging into another account in Xfce.  In other words I log into Xfce, then I open a terminal and log into another account.  Now I am getting an issue that X cannot Open the Display.  I get this "(zenity:69161): Gtk-WARNING **: 01:01:53.391: cannot open display: :0.0"  The DISPLAY variable is exactly the same in both instances that I am logged into.  What can
06:03:19 <Grell> be the problem?  Thanks.
06:21:51 <tm512> still having issues with getting this wireless card to reliably connect. I'm sitting only a few feet from this router, and wpa_cli status reports that the wpa_state is "SCANNING"
06:22:05 <tm512> finally just connected after several minutes
06:23:10 <miko> tm512: is this regarding the t495?
06:24:07 <tm512> yeah, with its Intel AC 9260 wireless chipset
06:25:19 <miko> yeah, it barely even works on linux ^^; on linux i had pass an option or two to not have the card constantly crash
06:25:32 <miko> er, to the kernel module
06:26:44 <tm512> kinda weird since I'm using the old, presumably more mature, iwm driver currently. I may give iwlwifi a spin
06:26:52 <miko> gimme two secs and i'll get the stuff i had to pass, might be somewhat applicable to freebsd if you're lucky
06:28:52 <miko> right, so on linux had to pass power_scheme=1 to the iwlmvm kernel module
06:29:09 <miko> *i had
06:29:48 <tm512> I don't think that's even a driver here on FreeBSD, it's iwm and then iwlwifi is the next-gen one which I think is the only option for some of the newer chipsets
06:30:05 <tm512> with the 9260 being kind of in that transitionary period where it has support from both
06:30:22 <tm512> dunno if iwm even comes from Linux, but iwlwifi does, at least in-part
06:31:03 <miko> iwlmvm is part of iwlwifi, its just that it's broken off as a separate module
06:32:08 <miko> quick grep in the freebsd src dir does show that the mvm stuff is in there at least
06:36:19 <tm512> worst-case scenario I'll just set up wifibox again though it kinda sucks to need that. had to use it with the E14 I'm replacing, because rtw88 on FreeBSD was completely busted, causing kernel panics when any meaningful amount of network traffic passed through the card (i.e. anything beyond, say, pinging)
06:36:44 <concussious> usb tethering works really nicely
06:37:35 <tm512> kinda unfortunate that I've gotta hustle on returning the E14, kept forgetting to send bug reports regarding rtw88
06:38:26 <tm512> from what I recall it was pretty weird. the kernel panic showed that the process crashing was rtw88, but the backtrace showed that it was crashing in drm-related functions, as in, the GPU driver stuff
06:38:56 <miko> tm512: there's a power_scheme sysctl tunable for iwm. try setting that to 1 and see what happens
06:45:56 <tm512> I'll look into that. any idea what it actually controls?
06:46:41 <tm512> oh, power management, so I guess 1 might make it more responsive but at the cost of increased power consumption?
06:46:44 <tm512> hrm
06:47:51 <miko> it disables power saving completely actually
06:48:55 <miko> unfortunately it's the only thing that worked for me
07:10:35 <Aedil> I wish you a good workflow for today, my FreeBSD 14 installations works excellent so far!
07:44:35 <crb> I'm trying to get some linux software running under the linux emulation.  There is a whole chain of ugly scripts calling each other which finally ends in checking the name -m  arch which we report as amd64 but which I'm guessing linux reports as x86_64, how do people handle this without modifiy the scripts?
10:38:38 <Aedil> The most complete solution for all your business needs is the UNIX enterprise software.
17:07:56 <thegman> i was just checking dmesg and the realtek adapter is showing up as "none1"
17:38:34 <voy4g3r2> thegman: have you checked out the realtek website to pul that driver? for my new machine i had to go that route to get my realtek 2.5gig onboard nic to show up
17:41:43 <thegman> i was about to install realtek-re-kmod https://www.freshports.org/net/realtek-re-kmod
17:41:45 <VimDiesel> Title: FreshPorts -- net/realtek-re-kmod: Kernel driver for Realtek PCIe Ethernet Controllers
17:41:52 <thegman> im pretty sure its the right one
18:45:52 <thegman> installing that driver fixed it
18:48:00 <scoobybejesus> is it normal for a zfs snapshot to take up a different amount of room on the backup box as the production box? production dataset shows 344G used.  backup box shows 235G used. pretty big discrepancy
19:00:29 <scoobybejesus> I wonder if this is an ashift thing, or something in that neighborhood.  Digging down, as one example, the same mp4 file on the backup box is 115M, and on prod it's 182M.
19:02:53 <scoobybejesus> It so happens that this dataset is shared via ZFS over NFS, and all the writing is happening from an application on a linux box (immich, a self-hosted google photos alternative).
19:14:44 <lts> Comression?
19:14:46 <lts> +p
19:52:08 <rtprio> scoobybejesus: it depends on the other snapshots also
20:33:30 <pr-asadi> Greetings. I have a Lenovo V330-15IKB laptop. I have FreeBSD 14.0-RELEASE-p5 on it. Usually after a few minutes, the laptop's fan starts working and it would not stop. Why is it like this?
20:33:41 <pr-asadi> How can I control it? Is there even any solution?
20:42:19 <sfox> powerd
20:57:24 <scoobybejesus> i have compression in both. in prod it's lz4, and i'm not sure if it's lz4 or zstd on the backup box. they are both only in the 1.01 - 1.03x range.
21:00:49 <scoobybejesus> i started deleting some older snapshots, even though they are barely referring to any unique data, hoping i'd find that space was freed up.  that didn't work.  files are straight up taking up different room on each device.
21:04:33 <scoobybejesus> i thought i was doing something smart at the time (and maybe/hopefully it is for read speeds), but this seems to be a likely culprit...  on prod, my recordsize is 1M for this dataset.  on the backup box, the recordsize is 128K
21:06:18 <scoobybejesus> the software automatically transcodes everything, creating thumbnails and whatnot.  i'm guessing the 1M thumbnails are able to fit into 128k on the backup box.  though this doesn't explain (in my mind) why a 115M video takes up 182M on the prod box
21:09:39 <scoobybejesus> interesting problem/issue, one way or another
21:49:58 <rwp> scoobybejesus, Video and Audio compressed won't be able to compress any further.  So if the compression is lz4 or zstd and on for both main and backup I would expect that neither would be able to compress more.
21:50:34 <rwp> I would expect that if compression is off that though the A-V files won't compress but other files would compress.
21:50:46 <rwp> I always have compression on with either lz4 or zstd.
21:51:00 <scoobybejesus> indeed, indeed. I was just pointing out there compression doesn't seem to reflect what is different between prod and backup
21:53:09 <rwp> I often run this command to give me a showing of interesting attributes for datasets.
21:53:14 <rwp> zfs list -o compression,compressratio,refquota,quota,used,usedds,usedsnap,refer,creation,name
21:57:22 <jmnbtslsQE> scoobybejesus: how are you determining that the example mp4 file has different sizes?
21:58:59 <jmnbtslsQE> if you're looking at the filesystem and it's different sizes it's just not the same data, unless i'm missing something
21:59:11 <jmnbtslsQE> (the file different sizes i mean)
22:01:50 <jmnbtslsQE> but either way, one thing that can cause a different in dataset size in this situation with a 1M recordsize is if you had compression disabled at one point and had many files written without compression, filling part of that 1M with zeros. then when you send/recv with compression that gets compressed away
22:01:51 <scoobybejesus> i used dust, but i could use ls
22:02:11 <scoobybejesus> i haven't changed the properties of the datasets since inception
22:02:22 <jmnbtslsQE> OK
22:02:48 <CrtxReavr> Boy, the dependency list for mtr seems rediculous.
22:03:45 <CrtxReavr> https://bpa.st/NV2A
22:03:46 <VimDiesel> Title: View paste NV2A
22:06:21 <CrtxReavr> I guess there's an mtr-nox11 package.
22:08:08 <scoobybejesus> Interesting.  `ls` shows the same 115M in both prod and backup.  `dust` on prod shows 182M for the same file and 115M on backup.  So, yeah, this 115M file is the same in both places, but somehow `dust` (in addition to zfs, of course) knows it's taking up 182M on disk on prod
22:10:01 <scoobybejesus> `dust` is a newer `du`.  `du` shows 186393 on prod and 118209 on backup
22:14:48 <scoobybejesus> so perhaps these media files in some cases are sparse files, and so the OS/FS thinks it is intelligently using space?  or maybe something else?
22:16:06 <scoobybejesus> but i would think sparse files would benefit from compression.  hmmmmm
22:16:30 <jmnbtslsQE> if they're sparse on the source they should be sparse on the destination i think
22:16:49 <jmnbtslsQE> https://github.com/openzfs/zfs/discussions/11533#discussioncomment-315578 talks about some random items that could take up blocks in addition to the file itself. not sure if it's applicable here
22:16:51 <VimDiesel> Title: Why does stat(2) .st_blocks reflect ZFS compression? · openzfs/zfs · Discussion #11533 · GitHub
22:18:59 <jmnbtslsQE> (st_blocks is what du and dust are using)
22:20:02 <jmnbtslsQE> so,  dunno honestly
22:24:26 <scoobybejesus> interesting.  when i copy the file. the resulting copy is only 115M.  apparently cp is good at identifying a sparse file and only copying the actual data
22:33:24 <jmnbtslsQE> i think you are right that cp does copy sparse files properly. but i don't see how it's related to sparse files. i think that would involve entire (zfs) records that are zero
22:34:18 <jmnbtslsQE> and besides, if you have compression enabled on both sides and have always had, then sparseness should not make a large difference
22:42:17 <scoobybejesus> before copying, the file takes up space of 182M, and after copying it takes 115M.  maybe there is something going on that's related to sparseness or has the same effect
22:44:37 <scoobybejesus> the only thing I can come up with is that writing to an NFS-mounted filesystem is causing sparseness to not being handled property
23:37:18 <scoobybejesus> the guy who founded the project linked me to a stackoverflow answer on the difference between `ls` and `du` instead of telling me whether he experiences the same thing.  frustrating