09:04:03 Huh, I didn't know/recall that bgscan can be per-BSSID for wpa_supplicant.conf(5). 09:05:22 (It's the option that lets you adjust when scanning occurs, to improve roaming on multi-BSSID networks, based on received signal strength, if memory serves. 10:34:13 <_xor> Quick poll: What does the phrase "function signature" mean to you? 10:50:54 why are there 2 lines of production releases? 13.2 -> 13.3 and 14.0 -> 14.1 ? due to some major changes or something? if i'm installing from scratch, do i go for 14.0? (for personal desktop) 11:00:20 because support times for major releases overlap (and major releases have a stable abi), yes, go with 14 11:02:36 thank you :) 11:20:38 _xor: I would say the required parameters describe function signature 11:25:04 Hello everybody, I try to use my printer with cups, I follows the doc but I want to print a pdf , it's nothong to do, I have not message in /var/log/messages. 11:54:43 Hi! Can somebody give me a pointer towards TLS/SSL "trusted CAs" in FreeBSD? it seems the jail setup procedure from the Handbook does not take care of this: `curl` and `wget` inside a fresh jail cannot verify e.g. https of google.com, while the host directly makes the `wget` call without any errors. (interestingly, firefox on X11 inside the same jail worked just fine) 12:24:39 aaah, I think I got it. /etc/ssl/certs are symlinks, and because the Handbook example of jails makes /etc in the jail a symlink one level deeper (/skeleton/etc), those symlinks do not point to /usr/share correctly, but to /skeleton/usr/share (not existing) 12:37:37 solved it. might be worth another addition in the Handbook 13:50:32 how do I look up the meaning of /dev/ nodes? 13:50:52 their individual purposes 13:57:01 albertus: for most of them, man , where basename is the device name without the unit number 14:05:33 no luck for `console`, `kbd`... 14:05:59 I think kbd0, kbd1 will be keyboards, but I'd like to browse some actual docs 14:06:21 trying to figure out devfs.rules for a jail in which I'm running X11 14:10:20 albertus: for me, /dev/kdb4 is a symlink to /dev/ukbd4 which does have a manpage (ukbd(4)) 14:11:26 ah, you're right 14:12:01 console should probably grow a manpage even if it's just a pointer to the actual console devices 15:47:01 albertus: I'd recommend using bsdinstall(8) for jails, as it also takes care of things you'd normally need to do with certctl(8). 15:47:59 As you can probably guess, bsdinstall is what's run automatically when you boot installation media, and it has a subcommand specifically for creating jails. 15:50:27 `apropos console` would've gotten you pointed towards vt(4), which is the console driver on FreeBSD. 15:51:22 /dev/console could also be a serial line though (or something else like a VM console) which is why i was thinking it could do with a manpage 15:51:42 apropos(1), whatis(1) (and to some extent whereis) are _very_ useful utilities when dealing with manual pages. 15:52:12 lw: creating a MLINK to it from vt(4) wouldn't be a bad idea. 15:53:01 s/eis/eis(1)/ 16:19:38 lw 16:19:39 lw my friend 16:19:44 lw, I think I might have found something. 16:19:59 jbo: buried pirate treasure? 16:20:04 lol 16:20:04 https://github.com/soasis/text 16:20:05 Title: GitHub - soasis/text: A spicy text library for C++ that has the explicit goal of enabling the entire ecosystem to share in proper forward progress towards a bright Unicode future. 16:20:14 jbo: that's the one i was thinking of before! 16:20:14 lw, and blog post that goes with that: https://thephd.dev/any-encoding-ever-ztd-text-unicode-cpp 16:20:15 Title: Any Encoding, Ever - ztd.text and Unicode for C++ | The Pasture 16:20:28 couldn't remember what it was called 16:20:30 lw, nice - when I read the docs and everything I thought "this must be the one lw mentioned" :D 16:20:52 this is looking extremely promising. I have no idea how that lib is not getting more exposure 16:20:56 I think I'll take it for a spin tonight 16:37:34 lw, have you actually used this or only looked at it? 16:37:53 jbo: i used it and briefly spoke to the author about it ages ago (who seemed to know what they were doing) 16:38:05 i mean, i didn't use it in any actual software, i just tested it quickly 16:38:13 lw, ack 16:38:14 can't actually remember how that went now :-) 16:38:25 too much or not enough vodka? 16:41:07 lw: can you ELI5 why this library is amazing? 16:59:39 johnjaye: C++ has no good way to process Unicode text, this library lets you do that 17:00:05 that is a shocking statement 17:00:10 but i guess i asked for it 17:01:03 how is that shocking? proper text support being absent in C/C++ is probably one of the most valid hater arguments 17:01:09 it's a real pain. 17:01:51 and it doesn't help that ICU, the most common third-party library for this, has a rather dated API, like using UTF-16 internally 17:01:58 probably just because it's such a basic thing you'd think it would have been solved by now 17:02:30 it is anything but a basic thing. 17:02:40 it is probably one of the more complex challenges to solve 17:02:56 it's basic in the sense that it really should be in the language though 17:03:02 oh, yes. 17:03:04 I agree. 17:03:17 sorry - I misunderstood :) 17:04:14 lw, I'm now going to change the payload type from uint8_t to std::byte so be prepared for painful questions. 17:04:19 i meant more in terms of being fundamental to doing other things 17:04:23 but yes that as well 17:04:34 jbo: don't byte off more than you can chew 17:04:41 badum-tss 17:04:58 lw, I did encounter std::as_bytes and std::as_writable_bytes in the meantime :D 18:24:17 Hello 18:24:23 How do I use bsdisks? 18:24:36 Could not register UDisks2 service 18:24:45 That just doesn't work 18:25:28 hm, is dbus running? (but I throught it should autostart if it isn't) 18:26:30 How do I even start it? 18:26:38 The most recent versions of packages are already installed 18:26:53 % sudo pkg install dbus 18:32:38 How do i correctly start that dbus? 18:32:41 I can't see any service 18:37:58 oh, ok, service dbus start 18:38:06 but it is anyway isn't working 19:00:31 % sudo bsdisks --detach /dev/da0 19:00:33 hmmmm 19:00:37 nothing is happening? 19:00:53 I've been trying to compile a program with the help of edk2, but I've had no success so far. 19:01:15 I took a look at this: https://bsdio.com/uefi/building-under-freebsd 19:01:16 Title: | Bex' Site 19:01:34 16 19:02:13 the site says: "Create the following symlinks in BaseTools/Bin/FreeBSD-amd64:" 19:02:24 Is FreeBSD-amd64 a file in this case? 19:06:25 /sys/block/(whatever)/device/delete 19:06:29 where is this path? 19:06:33 i want to power off the HDD 19:09:06 what is hdparm in FreeBSD? 19:11:35 i don't think there's a direct equivalent. what do you want to do? maybe diskinfo or dd can substitute 19:14:58 i want to power off the disk 19:44:29 V-T60: camcontrol(8) is what you're looking for to power off a disk 20:27:24 so I'm thinking I'll finally get around to making a dwm status bar script for FreeBSD. I'm guessing I'll probably want to use vmstat for grabbing CPU usage, unless there's something better? 20:28:26 I see that vmstat also reports memory usage, but it doesn't seem trivially machine-readable 20:51:44 you might dig it out of `sysctl vm` instead for memory 21:25:05 rtprio: at least at a glance I wasn't seeing free memory as a sysctl 21:25:50 I'm continually surprised that free(1) still hasn't been brought into the BSDs 21:26:58 I may just install and use freecolor which has an -o flag that makes it behave like Linux's free command 21:46:12 freecolor -o would let me port over the bit of script from my Linux status script pretty much unchanged and let me grab swap info along with RAM at the same time 21:51:47 something like: freecolor -o | awk '/Mem|Swap/{ print $2, $4, $9, $11 }' | { read mtotal mfree; read stotal sfree; ; } 21:54:49 maybe this is just a limitation of hwstat, but I wish for CPU temps it provided the overall package temperature, like what is listed as "Package id 0" by the sensors utility on Linux 21:58:40 and here i thought free was posix 22:03:02 evidently not. it seems like such an obvious utility to include in UNIX-like OSes, hence my surprise that it's absent in every BSD still 22:03:13 seems like it's a deliberate exclusion at this point 22:04:41 what I found interesting when I was most recently using NetBSD, is that free is excluded, but they've cloned /proc/meminfo from Linux 22:14:05 what did you do to find memory info in the original unix? like v7 or something right was the last one? 22:20:55 johnjaye: I think UNIX genealogy is a bit more complicated than that. I've never used those vintage Unices though 22:22:00 has anyone else noticed that golang based daemons tend to spin the CPU a lot when in the 'pause' state? I've seen that on a variety of freebsd systems with a number of different ports. 22:26:26 johnjaye: does seem like V7 was sort of the common ancestor of modern UNIX variants though I'm presuming there was some crossover even after that point. but V7 seems like the point after which AT&T UNIX and BSD split off 22:28:15 I kinda like how the commercial/proprietary branch of that split is increasingly irrelevant as time goes on and that BSD is more or less thriving for what it is 22:31:01 only thing I like from that branch is illumos though I haven't really used it as much as I'd like to 22:34:32 my only memory of V7 was that we assumed it'd be memory-full and swapping continuously. But it's been a while 22:36:29 tuaris, I have not noticed that but I know that golang is a garbage collected memory system. Could it be doing garbage collection during that time? And please clarify what you mean by the pause state? 22:38:35 tm512, You are pretty much correct about the history but strongly influencing referencing v7 is also because the source for v7 was released into the public domain some years ago making it the most accessible reference point. 22:41:16 For myself I rather consider 4.4BSD Lite2 as being a major milestone. That was the first totally freed version. Missing some things due to the forced nature of removing non-free parts in order to create it. But from that point forward free software development could proceed. 22:42:11 This diagram is a fun trip down memory lane: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berkeley_Software_Distribution#/media/File:Unix_history-simple.svg 22:42:13 Title: Berkeley Software Distribution - Wikipedia 22:44:54 I'm a bit too young for it to be a trip down memory lane :P 22:45:02 only a bit older than FreeBSD itself 22:46:54 it doesn't mention Multics! 22:54:55 I spent most of my career on the right side of that diagram. Unfortunately in the red areas. 23:38:47 rwp: for example, this is what top shows: " 1872 netdata 219 68 19 625M 77M pause 29 289.6H 29.58% /usr/local/sbin/netdata -P /var/db/netdata/netdata.pid" 23:39:16 ok i need to stop using gentoo linux this is the second unexplained crash today 23:39:29 is dualbooting freebsd with some linux distro like void (used for steam and stuff) viable at all 23:50:07 why wouldn't it be? 23:50:16 also, some steam stuff works under freebsd