00:01:43 <RhodiumToad> nullfs seems to be fine
00:02:15 <RhodiumToad> (other than the issue with procstat -v, but that's mostly harmless)
00:03:19 <RhodiumToad> poudriere for example makes very heavy use of nullfs for jails (in the absence of zfs)
00:04:59 <rtprio> that sounds too complicated at the moment, but i will figure out how to trim down the world
00:07:33 <RhodiumToad> for ufs, there's also the option of mount -o union
00:07:48 <RhodiumToad> which unions only on the mountpoint dir, unlike unionfs
00:10:45 <rtprio> this is a sas hardware raid, so it's ufs
00:15:45 <rtprio> "unfortunatly"
00:25:36 <polyex> can we install listxattr on freebsd somehow? it's a dep of a rust thing i wanna compile
00:26:56 <parv> No
00:27:41 <parv> Is "listxattr" available as package|port?
00:27:55 <polyex> doesn't seem like it
00:28:58 <parv> Get the source to compile (& install) then
00:29:00 <RhodiumToad> it's a linux syscall?
00:29:12 <parv> Oh
00:30:25 <polyex> what's weird is i found this https://github.com/solidiquis/erdtree/pull/160 to make building it work on *bsd, yet it changes a cfg! from (target_os = "linux") to not(target_os = "macos")
00:30:26 <VimDiesel> Title: Use 3 arguments listxattr() on non-macOS Unix by iquiw · Pull Request #160 · solidiquis/erdtree · GitHub
00:30:42 <polyex> so it runs on freebsd... yet we don't have access to listxattr? crazy netbsd guys
00:33:30 <polyex> not sure what to do now
00:34:39 <RhodiumToad> who said it runs on freebsd?
00:35:20 <polyex> well the comment in that PR "In order to support *BSD especially."
00:44:59 <polyex> is it ok to edit /etc/ssh/sshd_config or should i edit something in /usr/local/etc?
00:45:18 <RhodiumToad> edit /etc/ssh/sshd_config
00:45:34 <polyex> ok ty
01:51:02 <V_PauAmma_V> Bummer. I lost sound upgrading from 13.1 to 13.2.
02:00:58 <polyex> just finished upgrading a bunch of boxes to 13.2 from 13.1 and all's well, ty very much freebsd project!!
03:04:59 <_xor> Is there a tool in ports to monitor keyboard state and emit events on changes?
03:05:43 <_xor> I basically just want to monitor the state of caps lock, num lock, and scroll lock in a blocking way from a script so that it emits a line for each state change.
03:14:26 <V_PauAmma_V> misc/kbdscan may be a starting point for this?
03:22:22 <_xor> Ah, that would probably work...but not ideal since it appears to automatically exit after 5 seconds of inactivity.
03:28:50 <_xor> Oh, I'm an idiot. I totally forgot the --query flag to evtest.
03:48:13 <V_PauAmma_V> Powercycling brought sound back, apparently. Not sure what happened.
04:38:14 <polyex> anywhere to get commit stats for fbsd going back 5-10 years?
04:38:20 <polyex> wanna look at trends and stuff
04:42:20 <Erhard> Github?
04:42:37 * Erhard shrugs
07:23:29 <meena> polyex: what kind of trends are you looking for, exactly?
07:44:47 <polyex> meena commits a day, committer quantity, ftp bw from ppl downloading installers
07:47:06 <meena> I think first two can indeed be extracted from the github API. note that committer and author are distinct concepts. but the third one has nothing to do with the version control
07:48:46 <meena> https://freshbsd.org/freebsd/src/branch/main aggregates some info, but I'm not sure you can easily extract stats
07:48:47 <VimDiesel> Title: FreeBSD / src - FreshBSD
08:06:07 <meena> the split from committer / author happened only with Git, although it was present from the start. but I'm fairly certain we don't have stats of that from the before time. it would've been a lot more effort to convert the subversion tree with that in mind
08:07:33 <meena> that means we can only really (easily) quantify outside contributions since git
08:53:42 <darwin> if you don't want to mess up /etc/profile but want some system-wide variables/aliases, would you put those in scripts in /etc/profile.d ?
08:57:06 <otis> yes. with .sh extension
08:57:14 <otis> # Load each .sh file in /etc/profile.d/, then /usr/local/etc/profile,
08:57:15 <otis> # then each .sh file in /usr/local/etc/profile.d/.
09:03:28 <darwin> so that's the order it does it in?
12:34:10 <rtprio> wish i could figure out why my server was crashing
12:35:00 <thorre> rtprio: Anything in the loggs?
12:36:33 <rtprio> nothing. it's at a family members house. there's nothing notable on the screen when it hangs. nothing in logs after it's rebooted
12:36:52 <rtprio> i hope it just needs vacuumed out, but i doubt that's it
12:36:59 <thorre> I assume it has non ECC memmory?
12:37:35 <thorre> If the machine has more then one memmory stick try removing one of them at a time
12:37:45 * thorre had a "broken" memmory stick a while agod.
12:37:55 <thorre> Got all kind of confusing behaviour.
12:38:05 <rtprio> it's a dell r710; it's ECC. i actually ordered ram there which i will be putting in next week
12:38:39 <rtprio> going from 48gb to 288gb. it's runs bhyve vms. and will be running a lot more of them.
12:39:29 <thorre> Have you run iDRAC diagnostics? The built in tests from DELL are quite good.
12:39:47 <thorre> Just to rule out some (not all) hardware faults.
12:41:12 <rtprio> i'll have to do that when i'm there. and get the drac on the network. it's drac-light so it's missing a dedicated drac lan
12:42:07 <thorre> Make sure that you upgrade all the firmware, there may be some bugs that DELL has patched.
12:42:55 <rtprio> it's pretty old now, but i'll check
14:06:20 <bsdbandit01_> good morning everyone
14:06:52 <xezo360hye> hello there
15:18:59 <simondvd> I was wondering if anyone could speak to the maintainers of the transmission-daemon port and ask them to update it? its been 8 months since the last update and I think the daemon is a relatively simple package. Thanks
15:19:18 <simondvd> https://www.freshports.org/net-p2p/transmission-daemon/
15:19:19 <VimDiesel> Title: FreshPorts -- net-p2p/transmission-daemon: Meta-port for Transmission BitTorrent client
15:19:26 <simondvd> there has been some updates here
15:19:29 <simondvd> https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=269504#c19
15:19:31 <VimDiesel> Title: 269504 – net-p2p/transmission-cli - New version available 4.0.3
15:20:22 <simondvd> is it waiting approval or something?
15:25:39 <simondvd> I was considering doing an old school make and configure but then I saw that bugzilla page :)
15:26:17 <simondvd> I would only make a mess been 20 years since I built from source, I remembe suse 5.2
15:33:56 <simondvd> OK i see it is still under review
15:34:05 <simondvd> https://reviews.freebsd.org/D40910
15:34:06 <VimDiesel> Title: ⚙ D40910 net-p2p/transmission: Update 3.00 -> 4.0.3 & modernize port.
15:34:45 <simondvd> thanks!
15:58:07 <xezo360hye> anyone alive here?
16:13:38 <alfonso> Is there some problem with http://www.efnet.org? irc/channels seem down too.
16:23:45 <la_mettrie> efnet's irc channels are working but that webpage seems to be down
16:40:29 <jak3b> quit
17:49:04 <ngortheone> sorry for offtopic, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37011324
17:49:05 <VimDiesel> Title: Bram Moolenaar has died | Hacker News
17:49:55 <mason> ngortheone: There's #freebsd-social too, which is often quite a reasonable place to be.
17:51:15 <carlavilla> yes, sad news :'(
18:47:36 <micdud> having trouble mounting nfsv4 shares as a user with vfs.usermount=1 enabled and user having enough rights to mountpoint (root mounts without problems)
19:19:51 <RhodiumToad> what error?
19:26:21 <micdud> mount_nfs: nmount: /mnt/temp: Operation not permitted
19:32:21 <RhodiumToad> what exact mount command?
19:32:25 <micdud> looks like filesystem permission error. but user can touch files inside mountpoints
19:33:15 <micdud> no command but mount from fstab 10.10.10.10:/srv/temp  /mnt/temp       nfs     sec=sys,vers=4,rw,soft,noauto,exec      0       0
19:34:06 <micdud> mount -t nfs 192.168.10.10:/srv/temp /mnt/temp  hangs
19:35:23 <micdud> actually spits out ([tcp] 192.168.10.10:/srv/common/temp: RPCPROG_NFS: RPC: Port mapper failure - RPC: Timed out) after a min
19:36:43 <RhodiumToad> if the server is nfsv4 only then mounting without the nfsv4 option won't work
19:36:55 <RhodiumToad> (nfsv4 does not use portmapper)
19:40:33 <micdud> -t nfv4 or nfsv4 in fstab do not work  like on linux clients
19:41:12 <micdud> and nfs_client_flags="-n 4" is enabled in rc.conf
19:41:38 <micdud> ohh wait that is a -4 isnt it ?
19:43:00 <RhodiumToad> what fbsd version?
19:45:11 <RhodiumToad> (I see nothing that uses nfs_client_flags anywhere? where did you get it?)
19:45:25 <tsoome> if portmapper is not responding, make sure your server has port 111 open and rpcbind running;)
19:45:37 <micdud> 13.1
19:45:39 <RhodiumToad> portmapper is not used for nfsv4
19:46:02 <tsoome> sure, but there is still the error message, you can not ignore that;)
19:46:31 <micdud> server is not running portmap  ( root mounting works fine) and linux clients are just fine without it on server
19:47:22 <RhodiumToad> micdud: so, what _EXACTLY_ did you do that produced the "mount_nfs: nmount: /mnt/temp: Operation not permitted" error?
19:47:50 <micdud> mount -t nfsv4 10.10.10.10:/srv/common/temp /mnt/temp
19:48:11 <RhodiumToad> micdud: as what user?
19:48:19 <micdud> mount -t nfs 10.10.10.10:/srv/common/temp /mnt/temp rather
19:48:21 <micdud> as user yes
19:49:13 <RhodiumToad> that command is the one that you said gave the portmapper error?
19:49:56 <micdud> yes
19:50:40 <RhodiumToad> it gives a portmapper error as root and "Operation not permitted" as a non-root user?
19:51:40 <tsoome> If you read mount_nfs, you should notice: nfsv2   Use the NFS Version 2 protocol (the default is to try version 3 first then version 2).
19:51:55 <tsoome> therefore, to mount v4, you need mount -t nfsv4
19:52:18 <micdud> mount -t nfsv4 192.168.10.10:/srv/common/temp /mnt/temp
19:52:21 <RhodiumToad> you mean -o nfsv4
19:52:30 <tsoome> yes, sorry
19:52:34 <RhodiumToad> mount -t nfs -o nfsv4 ...
19:52:49 <RhodiumToad> or  -o vers=4   (same thing)
19:53:12 <RhodiumToad> if you want to use the options from fstab then do  mount /mnt/temp  with no other options at all
19:54:32 <micdud> 192.168.10.10:/srv/common/temp  /mnt/temp       nfs     sec=sys,vers=4,rw,soft,noauto,exec   does not work for user
19:54:35 <micdud> works for root
19:55:57 <tsoome> yes, because by default, users are not allowed to mount.
19:56:02 <RhodiumToad> how EXACTLY are you doing the mount as a user?
19:56:30 <RhodiumToad> tsoome: they already said they have vfs.usermount enabled
19:56:33 <micdud> vfs.usermount=1 enabled
19:56:54 <micdud> mount /mnt/temp
19:57:40 <RhodiumToad> I assume this is not inside a jail?
19:57:48 <micdud> no jails
19:59:05 <RhodiumToad> is the nfs client module built into the kernel or already loaded?
19:59:23 <RhodiumToad> i.e. does nfs show up in lsvfs
19:59:41 <micdud> shows up
20:00:56 <RhodiumToad> ls -lod /mnt /mnt/temp   shows what?
20:01:39 <micdud> drwxrwxr-x  2 root  wheel  - 512 Aug  6 14:26 /mnt/temp
20:01:47 <micdud> weird  ls -al shows different
20:01:51 <micdud> and user can touch
20:02:03 <RhodiumToad> that explains the error
20:02:16 <micdud> ahh nevermind ls -al shows same
20:02:21 <RhodiumToad> it's not enough for the user to have write access to the mountpoint dir, they are required to _own_ it
20:03:39 <RhodiumToad> (or have PRIV_VFS_ADMIN granted by some mac module, but that presumably doesn't apply here)
20:04:47 <micdud> hmm , chown and ug+w same prob though
20:05:53 <RhodiumToad> ls shows what now?
20:06:23 <micdud> drwxrwxr-x  2 dan   dan    - 512 Aug  6 14:26 /mnt/temp
20:06:37 <tsoome> are users in client and server in sync?
20:06:53 <tsoome> + nfs4 domain
20:07:10 <micdud> uid and guid same
20:07:23 <tsoome> and user names?
20:07:41 <micdud> what is nfv4 domain ? same a krb5 domain ?
20:07:57 <micdud> yes username and guid uid same
20:08:26 <RhodiumToad> and the exact error from the mount command is the same?
20:08:48 <micdud> mount_nfs: nmount: /mnt/temp: Operation not permitted
20:09:54 <Erhard> You checked perms on / and /mnt I presume?
20:10:30 <RhodiumToad> those would likely give a different error, but check anyway
20:10:31 <tsoome> micdud see -domain description in NFSUSERD(8)
20:10:32 <Erhard> Usually not permitted means it is running asd non-root for some reason.
20:10:51 <RhodiumToad> I did ask for  ls -lod /mnt /mnt/temp   and not just /mnt/temp
20:11:09 <Erhard> I saw that request, but never the answer
20:11:25 <micdud> drwxr-xr-x  5 root  wheel  - 512 Aug  6 10:20 /mnt
20:11:34 <RhodiumToad> that's fine
20:11:36 <micdud> user is in wheel
20:11:44 <Erhard> k
20:11:59 <Erhard> ktrace it ?
20:14:37 <micdud> never used that but mount ; ktrace -i mount ?
20:15:33 <RhodiumToad> ktrace probably won't be informative here
20:15:51 <micdud> got a binary out :)
20:15:53 <RhodiumToad> but try it anyway:  ktrace -i mount /mnt/temp   and then  kdump -E
20:16:36 <RhodiumToad> look for the nmount call and paste that part of the output to dpaste.org or termbin.com
20:17:49 <micdud> nmount not in there
20:18:06 <RhodiumToad> oh? then look for an EPERM
20:19:24 <RhodiumToad> (but there must have been an nmount for it to report that in the error?)
20:20:16 <Erhard> You checked the logs on the other end too, I take it?
20:20:29 <micdud>   1164 mount_nfs 0.005518 CALL  nmount(0x801986000,0x16,0<><invalid>0)
20:20:42 <micdud>   1164 mount_nfs 0.047249 RET   nmount -1 errno 1 Operation not permitted
20:21:08 <Erhard> Do you see the input params?
20:21:21 <RhodiumToad> ktrace doesn't know how to log them, afaik
20:21:31 <Erhard> Ah, maybe that is the openbsd version
20:21:39 <Erhard> Or dtrace.
20:21:42 <Erhard> I can't recall
20:22:46 <Erhard> Might be NAMI's in there ?
20:23:43 <Erhard> Look around that call also for read()s from the filesystem., Sometimes you will see config files and salient bits
20:24:32 <RhodiumToad> oh, there's no NAMI, that's significant
20:24:44 <Erhard> Might be after GIO fd [0-9] read
20:25:00 <Erhard> I don't have a remote volume handy to mount
20:25:10 <Erhard> Was just looking at trace of mount -a
20:25:28 <RhodiumToad> micdud: you're sure that vfs.usermount is set?
20:25:49 <Erhard> Oh, you are still doing this as non-root?
20:26:28 <RhodiumToad> apparently it works as root
20:26:30 <micdud> # sysctl vfs.usermount=1   leads to  vfs.usermount: 1 -> 1 so i think so
20:26:34 <Erhard> As Operation not permitted is usually a check for uid 0
20:27:03 <Erhard> Client is allowed in server's /etc/exports if applicable?
20:27:19 <RhodiumToad> it's not getting as far as the server as far as I can tell?
20:27:19 <micdud> if root can mount , and yes
20:27:33 <Erhard> root CAN mount ?
20:27:56 <RhodiumToad> micdud: there's no NAMI line in the ktrace between the CALL nmount and RET nmount?
20:28:06 <RhodiumToad> micdud: or any other line for that matter?
20:28:31 <Erhard> Maybe termbin a grep -n30 around it
20:28:36 <micdud>  just  2 lines of 1164 mount_nfs 0.005545 NAMI  "/mnt/temp"
20:29:24 <RhodiumToad> ok, so there is a namei call
20:33:22 <RhodiumToad> so maybe it is reaching the server
20:33:27 <micdud> this is getting messy , ill post on forums i think
20:35:07 <micdud> and ps: i did have it work before somehow , even with mit krb5 , just do not write down exact steps (might need to just try again from a fresh install)
20:42:33 <Erhard> Where does mount get the root perms to allow a user to mount? It's net suid, nor is mount_nfs ?
20:44:47 <Erhard> Or is that not required? Weird.
20:45:31 <Erhard> mountd perhaps.
20:47:20 <Erhard> or nfsclient
20:50:23 <RhodiumToad> perms checks for mount are done in the kernel
20:50:48 <RhodiumToad> including checking for root vs. user and in the user case, whether they own the mountpoint
20:53:47 <Erhard> Interesting
20:54:19 <simondvd> i suspect a large spike in freebsd usage if ms forces win 11
20:54:36 <Erhard> Did you happen to have that bit of the source up? (like know right where that is)
20:55:47 <simondvd> the only reason I use windows for home user is computer games
20:55:55 <simondvd> for work is a different story
20:56:11 <yuripv> how is that freebsd related?
20:57:21 <simondvd> I am pretty at the point that I would switch to bsd for desktop use unfortunately that is not a consideration these days
20:58:38 <simondvd> it doesn't matter anyway bsd community don't care
20:59:09 <simondvd> there is no desktop bsd any longer
20:59:13 <simondvd> no suprise there
20:59:44 <simondvd> *clwn emoji*
21:01:47 * RhodiumToad has used nothing but freebsd for desktop since 1997
21:02:26 <Junxter> I remember a guy like RhdoiumToad from college
21:02:39 <simondvd> problem is there is no marketing there for custom X
21:03:10 <Junxter> and 1997 was the year I went to college
21:03:56 * RhodiumToad was long out of college by then
21:05:38 <Erhard> Yeah, I was married by then, lol
21:18:38 <simondvd> do you know that transmission is used by 1000s of people?
21:19:01 <simondvd> is freebsd obnoxious
21:20:03 <simondvd> probably under paid over worked
21:20:55 <simondvd> so long as it is not government psyop bs i am fine
21:26:34 <simondvd> 8 months to develop your malware haha joking
21:26:59 <simondvd> Clown emoji face
21:28:55 <simondvd> freebsd went woke already
21:28:59 <simondvd> years ago
21:31:30 <RhodiumToad> feel free to take your trolling elsewhere
21:42:52 <micdud> RhodiumToad: thanx for trying to help, i will spin up a new vm with 13.2 later, and try again from scratch (if does not work with then ill take it to the forums)
21:45:28 <simondvd> if you are thinking that is government psyop ps
21:48:00 <simondvd> it takes 8 months to update the largest torrent application ?
21:48:26 <simondvd> clown emjoi face
21:49:15 <simondvd> busy ya
22:28:26 <simondvd> call me crzzy all you want no answer for why it takes 8 months to update the most popular torrent client on freebsd
22:55:30 <polyex> if i have a vm, is it hard to set up traffic proxying on it to jails the vm hosts? i wanna work up a solid system for using jails like app containers
22:55:48 <polyex> but that means translating network to the vm, into the right jail (container) internally
22:55:51 <polyex> in and out
22:57:20 <RhodiumToad> jails can either have their own private IPs, or they can share one of the host's IPs
22:58:49 <RhodiumToad> basically, vnet jails have networking isolated from the host, but usually with a virtual network link to a bridge device on the host
22:59:09 <RhodiumToad> whereas non-vnet jails use the host's networking but constrained to one IP address
23:00:30 <RhodiumToad> on the host end, it can either just be a bridge, or you can have a full-on nat or transparent-proxying setup
23:00:43 <RhodiumToad> a lot depends on how you want to organize the IPs
23:02:03 <polyex> i was thinking to have host have single ipv4 address, then internally have the jails use ipv6
23:02:18 <polyex> to help save addresses even tho i want logically separate systems
23:02:27 <RhodiumToad> that'd be rather hard to do
23:02:35 <polyex> so i can put 5 systems on a single vm in the form of a jail but only use 1 ipv4 address
23:02:42 <polyex> oh dang
23:02:53 <RhodiumToad> if the host is v4-only, then you might as well make the jails private ipv4 addresses
23:03:05 <polyex> oh ya huh
23:03:59 <RhodiumToad> anyway, to do that you'd use nat on the host, with port forwarding rules if the jails are providing services
23:04:29 * RhodiumToad would use ipfw, but pf is popular
23:04:54 <polyex> can nat route based on http host param? like setting up vhosting but each host is in its own jail
23:05:22 <polyex> same ip to host, then www.foo.com to jail A, www.bar.com to jail B
23:05:33 <RhodiumToad> no, for that you'd want to put a proxy such as nginx in front
23:07:13 <polyex> hmm
23:07:55 <polyex> kinda like now where nginx reverse proxies to socket file paths for my different sites, but instead proxying to the internal ip of the right jail, right?
23:10:42 <RhodiumToad> ya
23:20:00 <polyex> hm ok
23:20:36 <polyex> because i want to make immutable infra, so i need to use jails for the actual workload, so when i update my app i just build a new jail then deploy that to the host
23:21:39 <polyex> i could use vms for the workload, but then i need n vms (which have a $ cost) vs n jails (which can be run on a single vm, or more, so more flexible cost)
23:21:45 <polyex> i'm thinking about that right?
23:34:51 <RhodiumToad> seems reasonable to me
23:35:55 <polyex> ty
23:40:08 <polyex> when i start a new vm from an install iso i have to run through the installer. but that's error prone and tedious and slow. can we modify installer isos so all of our configuration is already in place?
23:40:17 <polyex> so just boot the iso and it boots a configured server ready to go?
23:42:25 <RhodiumToad> I wouldn't use an install iso, I'd make my own vm image
23:42:51 <polyex> how do you do that?
23:43:08 <RhodiumToad> are you doing this on your own infrastructure or on a cloud provider?
23:43:19 <RhodiumToad> (because I'm not an expert on clouds)
23:43:59 <polyex> neither, rented vm from a hosting company. through web panel i upload an image to run when the vm starts
23:44:15 <polyex> so far only given it installer isos but i guess it doesn't have to be
23:44:25 <polyex> like a vultr vps or whatever
23:47:56 <RhodiumToad> the simpler option for you might be to customize the install iso; you can script the whole install and add packages and so on
23:48:07 <RhodiumToad> man bsdinstall  might get you started
23:49:47 <polyex> ya but you make your own vm images. how do you do that? like start a new vm in a hypervisor, configure it, shut it down, clone vm image and in the future just launch new vms from that image?
23:51:18 <RhodiumToad> I make mine from scratch from source, using buildworld/installworld
23:51:36 <RhodiumToad> but that's more work than most people would want to do
23:53:06 <RhodiumToad> you can instead install a distributed version into an image file using bsdinstall, I think
23:55:23 <RhodiumToad> I haven't played with the installer much to be honest.