03:21:46 <LxGHTNxNG> I do apologize for that outburst earlier...
04:32:14 <ixmpp> :3
04:33:46 <mcrane> conversation earlier about FreeBSD as a desktop
04:33:55 <mcrane> I use it for my desktop and my laptop
04:34:38 <mcrane> working great for most of my needs occasional software not built for BSD like some remote desktop software
04:34:49 <mcrane> anydesk works on freebsd and chrome remote desktop
04:35:17 <mcrane> FreeBSD is reaching past server only
04:35:56 <mcrane> You may have to select specific hardware in some cases
04:36:15 <mcrane> signal and telegram both work on FreeBSD for chat
04:36:33 <mcrane> obs works good for screen recording
04:37:02 <mcrane> I'm happier on FreeBSD desktop than I was full time on OSX or Windows
04:37:58 <rukus> and poeple think you the man when you answer "FreeBSD" after asking what linux distro you use.
04:38:45 <rtprio> unless you have to use docker or some other linux only cruft :|
04:39:13 <rtprio> docker on debian on bhyve on freebsd just isn't quite as streamlined
04:41:12 <mcrane> I don't care about docker
04:41:31 <mcrane> think docker is really closer to freebsd jails
04:41:39 <mcrane> than bhyve would be to docker
04:52:22 <ixmpp> podman in linuxulater could be not terrible
05:36:43 <rtprio> ixmpp: there's a lot more fucking around than you would expect
08:54:42 <LxGHTNxNG> ixmpp: oi (;
09:02:17 <meena> every couple of weeks i am reminded that classful IP addresses are still a thing: https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=268976#c1
09:02:20 <VimDiesel> Title: 268976 – Traffic will not route across two bridges on the same /8
09:03:50 <meena> classless addressing has been 30 years now, that's 13 years since I started using / learning computers, and I still had to learn about them.
09:04:03 <meena> (personally, I blame cisco)
09:19:02 <nacelle> ifconfig has been like that forever on the bsd boxes
09:19:11 <nacelle> solaris, etc. too
09:19:23 <nacelle> (which is kinda bsdish...)
09:55:08 <yuripv> so what netmask should have been implicitly used?
10:07:21 <cpet> 265.255.255.0
10:48:01 <meena> yuripv, cpet, honestly, maybe just /32?
10:48:24 <meena> that would be less surprising than /8
10:48:54 <meena> nacelle: i am not forever years old, however
10:52:33 <paulf> how long is forever?
10:53:23 <tsoome_> paulf 64-bits?:)
10:57:45 <cpet> Cidr non cidr
12:13:53 <yuripv> why not /32 if only address was specified?
12:31:36 <meena> yuripv: I think it would and most sense
12:38:08 <meena> s/and/make/
15:38:11 <khronos> Morning all from Florida.
15:39:05 <khronos> What Amazon ec2 instance type would be good for testing freebsd current builds on?
15:40:08 <khronos> When I build with the current hardware I have access to at the moment a build takes about 2 hours.
15:40:24 <khronos> make buildworld I mean.
15:44:59 <cpet> Man src.conf look at ccache
15:45:09 <cpet> And install ccache static
15:45:20 <cpet> Then use -j higher than the recommended
15:45:26 <cpet> And should be a bit faster
16:14:04 * meena mumbles something about PkgBase
16:24:48 <khronos> cpet: Cool. Found I can disable bluetooth and a few other things that I don't need on the test system.
16:31:09 <cpet> Yes but make sure you update ports before you do make delete-old-..
18:07:04 <CrtxReavr> I find -jX where X is 1.5x cores works best.
18:12:13 <cpet> 2.5
18:13:30 <cpet> Think that’s what is actually the maths in the makefile
19:02:38 <tuaris> How does cURL know which CA file to use?
19:03:17 <tuaris> When I use the verbose flag it shows "CAfile: none and  CApath: /etc/ssl/certs/"
19:03:39 <tuaris> but it's not actually loading all the CA in /etc/ssl/certs
19:06:28 <cpet> use/local/etc/ssl
19:06:40 <cpet> Most ports use local and don’t touch the system
19:07:26 <cpet> Or you can use lsof to see what it’s actually loading
20:04:29 <rwp> tuaris, AIUI curl uses libssl from core which uses --capath /etc/ssl/certs by default.
20:06:22 <cpet> He would know if is ran lsof
20:06:53 <rwp> curl runs very fast and is unlikely to be easy to catch while running by lsof.
20:07:34 <cpet> That’s why you pipe it to a file or more
20:07:37 <Kalten> `troff someprogram` tells more ;-)
20:08:06 <rwp> I think truss is the superior tool in this case: https://bsd.to/tWP0/raw
20:08:07 <VimDiesel> Title: tWP0
20:08:40 <Kalten> wrong command... hmmmm
20:09:10 <Kalten> Ah! I ment truss, yes
20:09:28 <Kalten> :-)
20:09:49 <rwp> Kalten, What are three typo'd letters among friends? :-)
20:11:15 <Kalten> rwp :-)  I am using that command toooo seldomly (lukily)
20:11:32 <cpet> Lsof would show what files are opened as well
20:12:25 <Kalten> yes, but lsof you have to time right. truss runs from start to finish of the programm
20:12:28 <rwp> lsof works excellently for daemons which run persistently and hold files open for a long time.
20:13:09 <rwp> But curl opens, reads, closes, files in milliseconds.  It would be hard to run lsof at just the right millisecond while curl was still active.
20:13:24 <Kalten> rwp: mostly, yes. And by far easier to handle
20:13:43 <meena> rwp: do strace / dtrace it is, then
20:15:33 <cpet> You only. Wes to see. The files once ssl lives in one location all you need if it loads from base or local
20:17:01 <rwp> meena, truss is trivial to run but dtrace is not so trivial and I have not mastered the dtrace skill.
20:17:52 <meena> rwp: dtruss is a truss like wrapper using dtrace underneath
20:24:48 <rwp> It apparently dtrace needs some configuration to use: https://bsd.to/9Mhe/raw
20:24:49 <VimDiesel> Title: 9Mhe
20:42:50 <cracauer> dtrace needs to be run as root. On FreeBSD it'll work on the stock system, on Macs you need a csrutil command.
20:53:03 <meena> cracauer: I tried that, but had ca zero success, and so gave up in MacOS as actual OS, and just used it as Editor / Hypervisor
20:58:29 <reppard> hello folks. i'm having some issues with an elantech touchpad and was hoping someone might be able to give me some insight
20:59:03 <reppard> i've read the handbook and forums and tried probably to many things on the related topic
21:01:01 <reppard> xinput registers 2 devices " ETPS/2 Elantech Touchpad " and " CUST0001:00 04F3:30FA Mouse ". sysctl shows all the expected hw.psm.elantech things but none of these settings have any effect. i suspected the CUST device is what actually being used
21:01:45 <reppard> i confirmed by disabling it with xinput so it seems like my touchpad is being seen as a generic mouse even though elantech device is detected
21:02:33 <reppard> i'd really appreciate any help that could be offered. trying freebsd after years of linux. so far i love it but not being able to scroll is kind of a show stopper on this machine
21:08:38 <cracauer> meena: yeah, DTrace on macOS feels like an unwanted pet by now. Too bad, the tool knows some nifty tricks.
21:14:02 <cpet> reppard:  scroll ? Cli or x ?
21:14:32 <rtprio> it's a show stopper to press pgdn?
21:15:21 <cpet> Prnt screen then pgup or pgdwn
21:15:59 <rtprio> khronos: what's the rush for buildworld? most people don't stand around waiting for it to finish
21:16:17 <cpet> If you want to press your scroll button and have the cli or console scroll think that’s possible with syscons but not the uefi console
21:19:01 <yuripv> reppard: can you show how both are attached? (pastebin `devinfo -v`) not sure if i can really help, but could have an idea
21:20:32 <reppard> cpet: scrolling in x
21:21:34 <yuripv> in any case the ".... Mouse" one is probably driven by hms(4), try blacklisting it
21:21:47 <cpet> Have to map your keys in the configuration
21:21:50 <reppard> yuripv: getting that dump now
21:25:28 <reppard> pastebin: https://pastebin.com/AbNY2t3R
21:25:28 <VimDiesel> Title: nexus0 smbios0 efirtc0 cryptosoft0 aesni0 ram0 apic0 acpi0 - Pastebin.com
21:26:52 <reppard> rtprio: yes it is. pretty sure most ppl are adapted to some kind of scroll mechanism
21:27:33 <rtprio> my keyboard is missing a few keys; i think you can adapt
21:28:50 <reppard> both of my touchpad mechanical buttons are broken. i've adapted by using tap and two finger functions
21:29:33 <yuripv> reppard: tried input_mode sysctl in hconf(4) yet?
21:30:35 <reppard> yuripv: nope but i'll give it a try
21:31:02 <reppard> i can look into blacklisting as well. so long as i can figure out what to blacklist
21:31:12 <reppard> i appreciate the suggestions
21:32:24 <yuripv> i thought that it's attached by 2 different hid drivers; looks like it's not, and only hms(4) is there (wonder why mouse driver is attaching though, may be that hconf setting would help)
21:33:45 <reppard> sysctl dev.hconf.0.input_mode=1 < is this what you're suggesting?
21:34:38 <yuripv> man page says 3 for touchpad
21:35:20 <reppard> ahh thanx
21:40:35 <cpet> Google scrolling in x11 or xorg and it’ll show you what to add in and you just save it to xorg.d
21:42:31 <reppard> no go on the input_pethod. xorg still tags it as a mouse
21:43:11 <yuripv> so yes, i wonder why hmt(4) is not attaching, however it should be here: unknown pnpinfo page=0x000d usage=0x0005 bus=0x18 vendor=0x04f3 product=0x30fa version=0x0002 _HID=CUST0001 at index=2
21:43:35 <reppard> cpet: i've done that plenty. the config runs fine and xorg shows it applying the input options but its associated with "Elantech/.." and xorg ends up using "CUST:0001..."
21:43:36 <cpet> Pciid
21:43:39 <yuripv> 0x000d is "digiters", and "0x0005" subitem is "touchpad"
21:43:55 <yuripv> err, digitizers
21:45:01 <yuripv> reppard: you have hmt driver, right (/boot/kernel/hmt.ko)? not sure when it was introduced
21:45:15 <reppard> lemme check
21:45:59 <reppard> yeah i've got it
21:46:17 <reppard> and verified its loaded
21:51:37 <yuripv> i'm not sure how to completely disable module loading other than temporarily moving it away from /boot/kernel/, try that for hms?
21:52:09 <reppard> maybe hms_load="NO" in /etc/rc.conf?
21:52:37 <rtprio> _load go in loader.conf not rc.conf
21:54:09 <yuripv> it's autoloaded as a dependency, i don't think any loader.conf/rc.conf settings will help
21:54:54 <yuripv> i'm just wondering if it successfully attached hms on index 0 and stops there not even trying to attach hmt to index 2 for that device
21:55:50 <yuripv> (but hconf is there so i'm probably wrong)
21:58:24 <reppard> i moved hmt and it results in CUST:0001* not being found or loaded
21:58:39 <reppard> though now, i have no mouse/trackpad at all
22:01:06 <yuripv> :(
22:01:49 <yuripv> you mean hms, most likely; other than that, are there any errors from hmt in system log?
22:04:54 <reppard> nothing
22:16:28 <reppard> found a forum post that might provide some fruit
22:17:55 <yuripv> could you share a link?
22:18:15 <reppard> https://forums.freebsd.org/threads/making-i2c-elan-touchpad-work-elan0d07-00-04f3-3078-on-a3511.86749/
22:18:16 <VimDiesel> Title: Solved - Making i2c ELAN touchpad work (ELAN0D07:00 04F3:3078 on A3511) | The FreeBSD Forums
22:18:46 <reppard> slighly different model id, same vendor
22:18:52 <reppard> same symptoms
22:40:13 <cpet> Kld are based on pciid if it’s not in there won’t detect it even adding may still not make it work this is where you email the maintainer directly
22:40:24 <cpet> Do it’s fixed and win win
22:46:00 <cpet> which pkg do you have
22:46:15 <cpet> pkg info|grep xf86
22:47:37 <reppard> either xf86-input-libinput or xf86-input-synaptics depending on which possible solution i'm trying
22:47:59 <reppard> i'm trying to stick with libinput as that seems to be the accepted wisdom
22:48:08 <cpet> that doesnt answer my question
22:48:29 <cpet> what ever works (TM)
22:48:48 <reppard> sorry, i'm new in bsd world
22:49:18 <cpet> sorry but in the BSD world sometimes you have to just accept that X doesnt work
22:49:32 <reppard> can you clarify the question?
22:49:41 <cpet> or learn how to addd in PCIIDs and recompile
22:50:00 <cpet> that wasnt a question but a truth of using any BSD
22:50:34 <reppard> i'm using xorg-7.7_3 if thats what you meant >  < cpet> which pkg do you have
22:51:02 <cpet> well you said I use x for something and y for something else
22:51:14 <cpet> which didint answer my question as to which one you are using now
22:51:29 <reppard> ahh i'm using libinput
22:51:48 <cpet> tried synaptics ?
22:51:53 <reppard> yup
22:52:17 <cpet> is it seen as a USB device ?
22:52:22 <reppard> if i try to force synaptics on that CUST:001 device it complains about the protocol
22:52:39 <cpet> is this a VM ?
22:53:17 <reppard> nothing in usbconfig that i can tell. not a vm, running on metal
22:53:47 <cpet> what does dmesg say
22:53:56 <cpet> as well as pciconf -lv
22:54:02 <cpet> look for none*
22:54:15 <cpet> if it says none next to it you may have to hack the driver or live with an external mouse
22:54:41 <cpet> preferably msg me the listing I hate using those dumb pastebins
22:54:56 <cpet> have to load x, then login just to view a paste
22:55:41 <reppard> nothing in pciconf. just controllers and display
22:56:23 <cpet> should show all the things as well as with usbcoinfig
22:56:31 <reppard> i'm not opposed to patching and recompiling
22:56:32 <cpet> which tells me its not being found
22:57:07 * cpet reads the topic and gigles regarding argue resp.
22:57:12 <reppard> lemme try a different grep
22:58:17 <cpet> normally touchpads are connected through USB so you can view them using usbconfig
22:58:36 <cpet> but these days laptop are so software aware and no HW that it get weird
22:59:02 <reppard> not in usbconfig. xinput shows it though
22:59:27 <cpet> usiong libinput?
22:59:36 <reppard> yeah
22:59:53 <cpet> do you have moused running ?
23:00:29 <reppard> no but i've tried starting it before
23:00:42 <cpet> we;ll crap what does xinput list say ?
23:01:49 <reppard> msging you output