00:00:27 <_xor> FUZxxl: I ran into your very issue a while back. 00:02:02 <_xor> FUZxxl: FUZxxl: Did you dedicate the whole disk to zfs or did you specifically setup gpt with a freebsd-zfs partition? 00:02:13 * _xor just grepped for his old notes on the subject 00:03:39 <_xor> "Basically, next time setup a GPT+ZFS scheme+partition instead of giving ZFS the whole disk. There's not much benefit to the latter and with the former glabel can be used along with sysctl kern.geom.label.gpt=1 variable set." 00:04:14 <_xor> ^ That's what came back, but I'm pretty sure I wrote some more details down about it. I think that section is in my "sort-me-bucket" :/ 00:05:22 _xor: no zfs involved 00:05:36 sorry, I mean no gpt involved 00:05:43 <_xor> FUZxxl: I think there was also something about making sure to do `zpool labelclear` when changing the label, otherwise it would still pick up the old label name (from the copy of zfs metadata at the end of the partition, I think). 00:05:43 the stack is: whole disk -> glabel -> eli -> zfs 00:05:47 <_xor> ah yeah 00:06:16 <_xor> I was giving it the whole disk too usually, until I ran into the potential labeling issues. 00:06:46 in my case, what worked was "zpool offline tank label/foo; glabel destroy label/foo; glabel label bar da0; zpool online tank label/foo label/bar" 00:07:06 in the zpool-online step you have to tell zfs that the disk has changed its name 00:07:26 <_xor> Ah, didn't know zpool-online accept that as an arg. 00:07:47 hm wait 00:07:48 it doesn't 00:07:50 hm hm 00:07:57 maybe it was just zpool online tank label/bar 00:08:15 <_xor> Yes, I was just about to say lol. I did a man zpool-online and wondered if my man pages were somehow out of date heh. 00:15:18 <_xor> FUZxxl: Oh, I think what it was is that I would create a GPT scheme with MBR,EFI,SWAP,ZFS partition layout, and then use glabel to actually write the labels (which are persisted as gpt metadata in "automatic" mode). 00:16:29 <_xor> Just need to make the relevant syctl variables are enabled so that they show up in /dev/{gpt|label}/... 00:21:03 i think you could zpool replace it, but whatever 00:31:04 <_xor> Great, just great. JRE core dumped when building devel/bazel. 00:31:06 * _xor sighs 00:36:03 you have more patience than i, to build that 00:36:14 and anything you need to build with bazel 00:43:16 <_xor> Apparently sysutils/podman-suite requires it :| 00:44:50 <_xor> Man, why are Google-originated projects such a PITA in the ass to build? 00:45:35 because they use bazel; i just installed the package of podman and it only took a minute 00:45:41 🙄 00:45:48 <_xor> I'm starting to wonder if there's some explicit internal policy that says something like, "Whenever working on OSS code, make sure to use fragile Linux-isms as much as humanly possible, even where not necessary." 00:46:25 <_xor> I use an internal repo via poudriere, so I essentially have to build it. 00:48:45 an internal repo that's not git.freebsd.org/ports.git ? 00:50:17 <_xor> Kind of, that one is the main and then I have two overlay trees, one for custom general ports and another one for private ports for apps I've built. 00:50:55 guys I am almost done with my skeloton project as a skeleton using bazel 00:51:14 <_xor> Though I was more referring to poudriere:make.conf and options in there, so it could be that devel/bazel requires something that I'm explicitly unsetting, though then that would mean the port is broken in that corner case. 00:51:48 i am going to bazel those arm cortex family 00:52:03 it took me at least two tries to build bezel, but i chalked it up to "running ports over nfs and assumed clocks were off" 00:52:17 <_xor> What's so great about bazel? 00:53:10 arm: "yamete test me in parallel! i get too fast in development! I can no longer annoy developers!" 00:53:14 <_xor> My preference is go-task -> just -> cmake/make. I've tried others like scons, but found they were more trouble for me then they were worth. 00:53:39 <_xor> Evaluating a few implementations of djb's redo though is on my TODO list, just not high priority. 04:15:15 trying to update to 12.3 to 12.4 etcupdate confusing and fucking sucks screw this 04:25:23 After going through every file to to resolve conflicts manually; afterwards it starts merging stuff that wasn't showing as difference when manually resolving and for a single file "Does this look reasonable?" and I press no and I have to go back from the beginning. fucking unacceptable 04:27:26 what does it mean to look reasonable to merge shit I specifically :q out of the file for to avoid being merged 04:28:15 <<<<<< current version is that part of file when resolving conflicts or not? I'm seeing it in vi the editor, this makes no sense 04:30:17 it is much like git conflicts 04:30:26 if you seen such 04:40:53 angry_vincent: maybe i am putting anger on the wrong tool. Is freebsd-update using its own merging method that separate than etcupdate or mergemaster? 04:41:59 i believe, etcupdate is now default, unless you use oler versions of FreeBSD 04:45:33 older* 05:15:54 no 05:16:09 freebsd-update uses neither of these, it does its own diff3 05:16:54 patches welcome 06:52:56 yetoo: yeah, somehow the old mergemaster i thought was easier to use 07:05:45 Like I spend an hour on going through the enter to fix the merge and then after that it goes through the changes I made and it asks if it's reasonable. It looks like I made a mistake and so I press n and then it quits so I run freebsd-update -r 12.4-RELEASE upgrade again and all the changes I made are gone. Who thought this was a good idea? How can I reuse what I spent an hour on? I made a backup of the new and old directories in /var/db/freebsd-update/ is it 07:05:45 as simple as copying them back to the directory but then :q all the subsequent prompts? it's stupid 08:49:49 regarding upgrades.. what's the status of PKGBASE ? 09:00:57 hm can I do path expansion in #!/bin/sh scripts? 09:01:05 GRAYLOG=$(ls /iocell/tags/graylog/root/var/db/{graylog,mongodb}/.zfs/snapshot/daily-$(date -u +%Y-%m-%d)) 09:01:14 specifically like that 09:01:24 I'd assumed so, but it appears not to work 09:06:16 dch: I just tried it in 14-CURRENT and /bin/sh doesn't expand {1,2}.txt into 1.txt and 2.txt 09:06:26 yeah, me too 09:06:40 tcsh does 09:07:02 meka: mmmmm I stick to POSIX sh because my brain is small and I am tired 09:07:24 I use fish for day-to-day because it has all the nice things but no need for much default configuration 09:07:39 manpage calls this `pathname expansion` I believe 09:07:54 dch: we're the same on all points :o) 09:48:47 is it safe to share /var/db/freebsd-update between multiple jails (nullfs mount) ? 10:13:09 mage: I'm using it, and i provide a repository: https://alpha.pkgbase.live/ 10:13:11 Title: Unofficial FreeBSD pkgbase repository 13:04:02 dammit my jailed zfs datasets don't mount automatically 13:13:35 i wonder if this is a new openzfs CURRENT thing 13:40:45 could someone please update the zrepl port ? :p 14:04:41 mage: why not do it yourself? https://docs.freebsd.org/en/books/porters-handbook/upgrading/ :P 14:04:42 Title: Chapter 11. Upgrading a Port | FreeBSD Documentation Portal 15:47:28 <_xor> rtprio: May I ask you for a favor? 15:47:52 <_xor> rtprio: Would you please take devel/bazel out back and put it out of its misery? plzkthnx 15:52:26 Morning all 15:52:52 but bazel is blessed by google, it must be good 16:06:44 * meena points at the 4568732 patches in our chromium port 16:06:49 "good" 16:17:37 <_xor> I'm having to build bazel because I'm trying to build some newer ports that rely on it. Those ports in turn could end up saving me a bunch of time as it'll preclude me from having to implement my own project to add support for FreeBSD. 16:18:04 <_xor> I swear though, if it takes me longer to fix/build/whatever bazel then it would to just finish implemeting my project, then... 16:18:25 <_xor> I'm going to tssk (or whatever it is that British people do) them so hard, they'll drop their tea and crumpets. 16:23:40 if I'm solely in the command line (no gui) is there anyway to copy/paste text on the screen? 16:25:48 Yes, with moused loaded. It's somewhere in the FAQ, IIRC. 16:26:47 Thank you 16:27:09 https://docs.freebsd.org/en/books/faq/#moused 16:27:10 Title: Frequently Asked Questions for FreeBSD 12.X and 13.X | FreeBSD Documentation Portal 16:30:14 RoyalYorK: if you're mouseless, I'd use copy/paste in tmux. 16:55:45 dch, Run "zfs list -o name,canmount,mounted,mountpoint /jails/myjaildataset" and verify that canmount is yes, noting it inherits from the parent dataset upon creation. 16:57:27 It also would not surprise me if there is a jail.conf to dynamically mount jail datasets but I don't know. 17:01:43 rwp, dch: https://alpha.pkgbase.live/howto/jails.html mount.fstab 17:01:44 Title: Howto: Setting up Jails 17:02:50 but for zfs stuff, i generally used exec.prestart 17:13:30 And I am not surprised at all that there is a way to dynamically mount datasets for jails. :-) Thanks meena! 17:13:49 Here's a silly question. Can I disallow a user from running `ps` ? Practically I just don't want them to see command line args of a process 17:13:54 it's for a CTF ^ 17:14:11 hello again 17:15:07 antranigv, IIRC it is the sysctl security.bsd.see_other_uids=0 and security.bsd.see_other_gids=0 settings. 17:16:03 rwp that I do know, I was wondering for the same user :D what could go wrong if I delete `ps` from a jail? 17:16:53 CTF? Okay. Deleting the executable would not disable the kernel syscalls though. If anyone can upload a new binary then that would not prevent them. 17:25:22 Also if it is in a jail then deleting ps really can't become too terribly bad, for a CTF it would not stop me from doing it, but some startup and shutdown scripts call ps to operate and will then fail if it is not present. 17:32:36 rwp: I always wondered why we don't use pgrep in rc 17:40:17 meena, I can only guess that since pgrep is a "new" addition in the grand scheme of things that it wasn't always in the base core but ps has always been. 17:41:32 The man pgrep page says pgrep first appeared in FreeBSD 5.3 modeled after the utility from other systems. 18:02:27 _xor: lol 18:24:51 yeah, rc is a lot older than 5.3 18:26:13 and switching FreeBSD rc to use pgrep wouldn't really do any harm wrt merging anything from NetBSD, because the code diverged already long ago 18:28:11 !!! 18:28:22 meena, absolutely fucking no. 18:28:39 When you start a process, you write a .pid file. 18:28:48 Then you use it to stop. 18:28:58 pgrep is some ghetto ass shit. 18:29:17 CrtxReavr: are u OK? 18:29:46 Not with that kinda nonsense flying about. 18:29:48 yeah, chill out CrtxReavr 18:31:22 * V_PauAmma_V could have done without the racial-slur-adjacent language as well. :-( 18:31:44 racial-slur-adjacent? 18:32:24 "ghetto ass shit" 18:32:34 That's in your own mind. 18:35:29 In any case ftp-proxy is the only thing I immediately find which uses ps for pids. 18:35:35 sendmail uses ps to generate hard to guess random seeds for certificate use. 18:41:34 antranigv: what is CTF in that context? 18:42:10 That's different; that's for entopy generation. 18:42:20 Though, there's still probably better ways to do so. 18:42:22 I am sure it is Capture The Flag. A computer security competition. 18:42:44 yuripv, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capture_the_flag_(cybersecurity) 18:42:46 Title: Capture the flag (cybersecurity) - Wikipedia 18:43:04 grep entropy /etc/defaults/rc.conf 18:43:14 rwp: i see, thanks 18:52:54 i'd still love to know why pgrep is ghetto-ass-shit. I wonder if other Solaris inspired Software is also ghetto-ass-shit? 18:56:04 it's about usage; you want to stop process that you started, not something you randomly match 19:01:27 in that case, we should port contracts from Solaris, because pidfiles are a plague 19:02:47 The problem is really about name collisions. Say you want to run multiple different nginx pools with different configurations. Then later want to stop/reload them. They don't identify by name well as they are all "nginx" by name. 19:03:53 contracts are really cool… 19:04:32 then you'll want smf to go with it, and then all out fighting begins 19:04:41 basically like Linux cgroups, but less awful 19:05:07 * V_PauAmma_V sighs at meena. 19:06:04 <_xor> rtprio: Got it to build, weird reason why it was failing. java/openjdk11 was building the previous minor version, even though I updated the tree to head. 19:06:12 Speaking of all out fighting remember we got here because of a Capture The Flag competition question, WCGW deleting ps from a jail? 19:06:21 <_xor> Oh well, whatever. Manual reset and update seemed to do the job. 19:08:05 feast your eyes on the vaporware occupying my brain for years now, https://scratchpad.pkgbase.live/Tn-dtb8OT--CttN1Djn8lw# 19:08:06 Title: jrc: Principles - HedgeDoc 19:10:36 at least you are not proposing 4th 19:11:09 yuripv it's a Capture The Flag competition! it's a hacking contest :) I've been deploying them on FreeBSD for years! 19:12:41 yuripv, You don't like RPN calculators? Heresy! It's the one true way. 19:13:00 meena, I am still cheering for runit, s6, nosh, or one of those variants. 19:13:02 antranigv: there is also pargs then 19:13:26 also top and whatever other utilities could show your the args 19:15:27 rwp: looking at the loader's .4th makes me shiver, i didn't look further than that :D 19:18:19 I admit I haven't spent any significant time with fourth. But at least it has an interesting language paradigm. But lua does not excite me. 19:19:24 meena: "Fault Manager, however, is Golden Grail of these designs", having recently been debugging mysterious memory leaks (which are not really leaks after all) in fmd, i would say that it's monstrosity, combining a lot of moving parts in it :) 20:20:13 i don't think anything would go wrong deleting ps 21:11:54 Out of curiosity, do you any of you use the **PURE** cli (no gui installed) or do you use the gui and use xterm or something along those lines 21:16:37 I only use X Windows (the gui) on my desktop. All other systems not my desktop being used as servers without X. 21:17:59 what is pure cli? i ssh into my servers. 21:18:55 I should have been more clear. What I meant by pure cli, is that when you boot up the system are you going directly to the tty and staying the tty or are you booting into a gui and using a terminal window 21:19:04 if you ssh, then you would be using the tty 21:19:07 <_xor> Oooooh very niiiice. 21:19:14 <_xor> OCI image looks to be running :D 21:19:58 I have managed to get xfce working from the tty (slim is another story), but I have more to learn in the terminal first before I use the gui on a regular basis 21:20:59 gui with multiple xterms is the way 21:21:16 i dont have the visual memory to flop between consoles so well, much easier to compare side by side 21:21:49 yuripv: unfortunately, even golden grails in software are still mostly made of software. 21:21:51 <_xor> Check out wezterm, it's my default terminal these days. It's so amaze. 21:22:01 <_xor> Been using it for a while now and it's the best terminal I've used thus far. 21:22:16 i donno, i don't think i could use the cli if not for `tmux` 21:22:39 <_xor> I was a heavy tmux user before, and I still like it, but don't have as much need for it these days with wezterm. 21:23:00 i'm using terminology nowadays 21:23:04 i'll check out wezterm 21:23:48 <_xor> rtprio: Wellp, looks like I won't have to finish writing my task driver after all. 21:24:01 does nexus work better on freebsd now? 21:24:20 <_xor> Though I think I still will since I've already implemented a non-trivial chunk of it. 21:24:34 <_xor> rtprio: You mean the artifacts repo by SonaType? 21:24:48 oh; 21:25:39 <_xor> Yeah, I got those new ports I mentioned earlier to build and just now set them up to run OCI images with my orchestrator. 21:25:57 <_xor> I was willing to spend up to an hour fiddling with it, but it only ended up taking 5 minutes. 22:14:21 hi all, I just updated two of my freebsd boxes, 12.3p10 -> 12.4p0 22:14:31 do I need to do something for pkg also? 22:19:29 rubin55, Yes. Also run "pkg upgrade" to upgrade the binary packages. 22:20:25 And then reboot. With that upgrade I found that after the "freebsd-upgrade install" that sshd needed to be restarted, which of course happens on reboot. 22:21:23 Release notes for that upgrade https://www.freebsd.org/releases/12.4R/relnotes/ 22:21:24 Title: FreeBSD 12.4-RELEASE Release Notes | The FreeBSD Project 22:22:08 mm, yes, I did that, but got no new updates.. since it's still 12.x, I didn't think too much of it, but wasn't sure 22:22:09 Oh, I almost forgot to mention "pkg autoremove" to clean up no unneeded packages. 22:22:34 If you have already upgraded all of the binary packages then I think all is good. 22:23:22 On a major OS release such as from 12 to 13 it has been recommended to reinstall all of the binary packages "pkg upgrade -f" to ensure that all shared libraries match. 22:24:09 right, fair enough! 22:24:51 The Handbook section on upgrading: https://docs.freebsd.org/en/books/handbook/cutting-edge/#updating-upgrading-freebsdupdate 22:24:52 Title: Chapter 25. Updating and Upgrading FreeBSD | FreeBSD Documentation Portal 22:25:20 That's a little confusing to read because it also covers source compiled upgrades intermixed in there. 22:25:40 But basically you have done everything you need to do for this upgrade from 12.3 to 12.4 so Good Job! 22:27:31 6 years! from 10.x to 11.x to 12.x 22:27:32 I'll note again the caution that on that for me 12.3 to 12.4 required sshd to be restarted before it would accept new logins. 22:28:01 Congratulations! You are an old-timer now for sure! :-) 22:28:09 every time I read freebsd docs I'm so impressed.. 22:28:15 lol 22:28:44 rtfm actually means something in bsd land 22:31:28 One thing I really very much appreciate about FreeBSD is that the base system is one cohesive whole. This makes upgrading reliable and safe. 22:33:01 rwp: this so much 22:52:43 @rubin55 yeah it means read the friendly manual instead of read the f'd-up manual. 22:55:18 Quantafac: exactly :) 23:37:57 hey, how do I list attached USB devices? 23:43:28 Network_Jack, If you are looking to see USB Storage then try "gpart show". 23:43:41 not storage, I am looking for a USB network device 23:46:26 Network_Jack: dmesg should list it (or /var/log/messages when attaching/detaching). 23:47:26 `usbconfig` shows all, that is attached to USB 23:47:37 Network_Jack, Try "pciconf -l" and "pciconf -lev" 23:47:39 Kalten, thaanks 23:48:30 Oh, sorry, I missed the usb entirely with my pciconf commands. Ignore me. 23:48:33 you might have to load a kernel module or it could be usb-generic. 23:50:11 And I think, `/etc/devd.conf` (and the `/etc/devd/` directory) could be used, to automatically react to attaching and detaching.