00:15:31 <mweya> Hello, is this the right place to ask for help regarding a freebsd install
00:15:35 <mweya> ? :D
00:16:19 <mweya> whoops, nvm, I didn't read the top bar ;D
00:35:21 <LXGHTNXNG> e
00:44:44 <pedahzur> mweya: Yep, this is the right place. freebsd-ops is for help with IRC. :)
00:52:02 <LXGHTNXNG> hm
00:57:13 <pedahzur> LXGHTNXNG: Is that you...or a cat on your keyboard? :)
00:57:23 <LXGHTNXNG> is moi :-)
00:57:28 <LXGHTNXNG> sup?
01:04:57 <Kalten> cat owners should use fvwm ;-p
01:15:12 <satanist> I thought xfce
01:16:55 <mweya> pedahzur: Ah, thanks! I got the issue fixed :D
01:17:20 <LXGHTNXNG> I'm an xfce'ian
01:17:23 <LXGHTNXNG> I don't have an cat
01:17:36 <mweya> Protip, hot swapping hard disks while the live installer is running isn't a great idea :D
01:19:13 <Kalten> https://www.fvwm.org/Archive/Faq/#the-cat-safe-desktop-_
01:19:15 <VimDiesel> Title: The Official Fvwm FAQ
01:19:32 <Kalten> The cat safe desktop ^_^
01:21:30 <Kalten> There is even a `Style * MouseFocus` ;-)
01:28:14 <mweya> Random bsd term question, is it possible to install alternative keyboard layouts?
01:28:18 <mweya> As in
01:29:13 <mweya> I'm trying to set the active keyboard layout to what looks like it should be de(mac)  (source coming later) but it looks like that's only a valid option for x11
01:29:25 <mweya> I however don't really want the overhead of a DE :D
01:29:30 <mweya> (source: https://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=xkeyboard-config&sektion=7&format=html#end)
01:29:32 <VimDiesel> Title: xkeyboard-config(7)
01:30:06 <mweya> Not installed, but I think that's a part of x11?
01:30:22 <mweya> I'm trying to avoid installing it :))
01:30:45 <pedahzur> mweya: As long as the RAID stays up during the hot swap, you're good! :P
01:31:21 <mweya> Closest I've come to getting the keyboard layout changed is kbdmap but that doesn't have the de(mac) layout :D
01:31:55 <mweya> pedahzur: Surprisingly not! It looks like the live installer doesn't detect new sata drives on the re-scan :D
01:32:53 <mweya> So I was pretty much stuck in a bit of a loop where I'd have to restart the system with the drive unplugged (so the wrong thing would'nt boot) and quickly plug it in as soon as I saw the red logo xD
01:33:47 <mweya> Pre-empting your upcoming "what, why?!1" -> I forgot my bios password :D
01:33:47 <pedahzur> mweya: Oh, software RAID? Seems life ZFS would notice the new drive. Odd.
01:34:12 <mweya> Oh wait looks like there's a bit of a misunderstanding
01:34:19 <mweya> I didn't set up raid at that point
01:34:21 <mweya> This was like
01:34:30 <mweya> During the initial OS install
01:38:30 <mweya> BIG bruh moment
01:40:25 <pedahzur> Interesting.
01:51:09 <mweya> Super dumb question, is there a repo of keyboard layout files somewhere?
01:54:12 <dkeav>  /usr/share/syscons/keymaps  /usr/share/vt/keymaps
01:54:38 <mweya> Yeah looked through those, but my keyboard layout isn't there
01:54:56 <mweya> It's something like a mix between the fr.macbook.acc.kbd and the german.iso.kbd ones :'D
01:55:12 <dkeav> oof
01:55:34 <mweya> Seems to be what's referred to as "de(mac)" in X11, but I've got no X
01:56:02 <mweya> And I'm to stubborn to give up and install a whole DE just to get my keyboard working xD
01:56:49 <dkeav> i guess read through the kdbcontrol kdbmap man pages, clone a keymap that is close and modify to suit  your needs
01:56:50 <Kalten> it is a human readable file: you could edit it.
01:57:41 <mweya> Yeah, I'm giving that a shot rn but copy pasting single characters in nano using the keyboard as I can't type them is slowly driving me insane
01:59:24 <Kalten> use an USB stick to edit it on another computer, or use youre network connection to do so
02:00:33 <mweya> I was really hoping there'd be another solution to this xD
02:00:54 <mweya> But thank you
02:00:57 <Kalten> search the internet for a file for your system ;-)
02:01:11 <mweya> :salute:
02:01:26 <Kalten> more often than not we are not allone with our problems
02:03:25 <mweya> https://raw.githubusercontent.com/freebsd/freebsd-src/main/share/syscons/keymaps/german.iso.kbd
02:03:45 <mweya> Found it! :D
02:04:11 <Kalten> :-)
02:08:09 <rwp> mweya, AFAIK the /usr/share/vt/keymaps/* are for the vt text console.  X is on top of that with setxkbmap for X.
02:08:25 <rwp> Though I know if I screw up the vt text console keymap that it ripples through to screwing up my X keymap.
02:08:30 <mweya> Yeah exactly!
02:09:03 <mweya> So, X has the right keyboard layout somewhere, but I've got no X, which is why I had an issue getting the keyboard working correctly :))
02:09:39 <rwp> I use a custom vt console keymap.  Because I wanted more than was offered in the standard set.
02:10:07 <rwp> And I only have things a little screwed up with it.  I need to get back to figuring out that last little bit.
02:11:49 <mweya> Sounds foreboding :D
02:12:54 <rwp> Not really.  And actually I suggest you simply jump in and give it a try.
02:14:01 <rwp> The part I have not figured out is how the default keymap causes Alt-key to produce ESC-key.  And if modify it then I lose the ESC prefix.
02:14:23 <rwp> That's a traditional Meta key configuration for terminals without a meta key.  To have an ESC prefix.
02:15:02 <rwp> But everything works perfectly in X.  So this is only an issue for me when I am not in X and working on the raw console.
02:15:57 <mweya> Ah, okay that's not bad
02:16:41 <mweya> Kinda related sidenote: I REALLY wish kbdcontrol would point out where it hit an invalid key definition instead of just stopping xD
02:21:29 <rwp> I am basically merging us.acc.kbd and us.emacs.kbd and us.unix.kbd and my own peculiarities into a hybrid key map.
02:22:02 <koobs> mweya: kevans loves hearing feedback about kbdcontrol :)
02:22:10 <rwp> My other small complaint is that the system provided keymaps are all printed using decimal when really for keys hex makes a lot more sense.
02:24:05 * shiroyasha would use the US layout anyway regardless of what is drawn on the keycaps.
02:24:26 <mweya> Oh man, don't let me speak to kevans until a week after I'm done setting this keyboard up xD
02:24:38 <shiroyasha> I got so annoyed in the past about being thrown into terminals where my muscle memory didn't work that I just changed to using US as default.
02:24:47 <mweya> Oh yeah, I'm with you rwp
02:24:57 <koobs> mweya: youll need to make a booking, but hope it all works well for you :)
02:25:46 <shiroyasha> And in the rare cases where I need to use non-ASCII characters, `setxkbmap -option compose:caps` goes a long way for me.
02:25:48 <mweya> shiroyasha yeah I was considering this too, but I bought a smaller keyboard missing a few keys so if I want to write C I'll need to do this :'D
02:25:58 <mweya> Thanks koobs!
02:26:39 <rwp> shiroyasha, setxkbmap is for X though.  Everything works perfectly for me in X.  I just want the vt console to also work just as perfectly. :-)
02:27:26 <shiroyasha> Yeah, if I need something outside ASCII I will be in X already.
02:27:53 <rwp> My keyboards have the Menu on one and PrtSc on the other in the same place (ThinkPad keyboard variations) and I use those as a Compose key.
02:33:38 <mweya> Ayo, freebsd lets you use the mouse in the terminal??
02:33:42 <mweya> This is awesome!
02:35:31 <rwp> I think that is "moused" which enables that feature.  Nothing but the best for you!
02:36:07 <mweya> :D
02:36:32 <rwp> Although for me personally I don't really use it.  But see "man moused" for the details on it.
02:36:55 <Kalten> It is wonderfulkl for copy/past ;-)
02:37:45 <rwp> I pretty much work such that I am always in tmux/screen with an emacs running in the first tab.  And both of those give me copy-paste that way. :-)
02:40:02 <mweya> Does FreeBSD have a list of errors that can be thrown by programs that ship with it documented somewhere? I was kind of expecting an "errors" section in the kbdcontrol man page but that doesn't seem to exist
02:40:21 <mweya> Unless I just don't know how to use man which is more than likely
02:41:42 <Kalten> Search for the text exit status`
02:42:26 <mweya> Doesn't seem to be in this doc
02:42:32 <mweya> http://man.info.in.ua/kbdcontrol.html
02:42:34 <VimDiesel> Title: FreeBSD/Linux/UNIX General Commands Manual - Hypertext Man Pages - kbdcontrol
02:42:37 <mweya> That's pretty much all I see
02:43:07 <Kalten> `exit status` is the return value. $? in e.g. sh
02:43:25 <mweya> AH that's what you mean
02:44:22 <mweya> Looks to be a generic error exit of 1
02:44:23 <rwp> I don't really see a lot of possible errors for kbdcontrol.  First time I am looking at it.  https://cgit.freebsd.org/src/tree/usr.sbin/kbdcontrol/kbdcontrol.c
02:44:24 <VimDiesel> Title: kbdcontrol.c « kbdcontrol « usr.sbin - src - FreeBSD source tree
02:44:25 <Kalten> manual pages are not that consistent, as well as programs. Some so tell something on stderr
02:44:54 <mweya> Line 305 is what's being thrown in my caswe
02:45:50 <mweya> Definitely due to the garbage I'm throwing at kbdcontrol but I'm slowly losing it trying to figure out if it's a layout issue or if some symbol is out of range :D
02:48:37 <mweya> Ah, ok, line 360, some character is out of range
02:48:39 <mweya> Thanks! :D
02:49:13 <rwp> This is actually of interest to me because I need to understand how to fix my own keymap but unfortunately I am being called away from the keyboard now...
02:49:39 <rwp> But if it gets too frustrating one could compile that with debug and step through it with the debugger and see exactly where things go right and where things go wrong.
02:50:30 <mweya> I just found something WILD
02:50:56 <mweya> If I take the normal, default german map, download it with wget and then try to load it, that error is thrown
02:51:35 <mweya> So it might just be that wget is responsible for this oof and that some invisible unicode is being added?
02:52:08 <mweya> By normal map, I mean: https://raw.githubusercontent.com/freebsd/freebsd-src/main/share/syscons/keymaps/german.iso.kbd
02:53:17 <Kalten> try using fetch instead of wget
02:55:14 <mweya> Still fails the same way but thanks for letting me know that fetch is a thing! :D
02:56:11 <Kalten> maybe some change between the version installed on your system and the source on raw.git...
02:56:37 <mweya> oh
02:56:41 <mweya> no this makes sense
02:56:54 <Kalten> do you still have the original from your installation? `diff -u originalfile newfetchfile`
02:56:58 <mweya> So, I kept updating the gist but didn't think to check to see if the url changed xD
02:57:24 <mweya> Everytime I updated the gist a new url with the new file was generated but I kept pulling the first version xD
02:58:42 <mweya> My bad, sorry for rashing xD
02:59:13 <Kalten> :-)  A case of an error between keyboard and chair
02:59:54 <Kalten> Such things happen easily
03:02:43 <mweya> Hahahah, that's an awesome saying! I'm going to steal it and use it later :D
03:03:52 <Kalten> It was not I how invented it ;-)
03:05:10 <last1> has apache 24 on freebsd 13.1 made some changes or something ? I'm seeing some errors I haven't seen in ages
03:05:21 <last1> such as: (2)No such file or directory: AH00075: Failed to enable the 'dataready' Accept Filter
03:07:28 <Kalten> maybe wrong file permissions for user/group www
03:08:00 <last1> well, I kldloaded those modules, now it says AH00016: Configuration Failed
03:08:04 <last1> but apachectl configtest returns ok
03:10:20 <Kalten> loading some kernel modules lead to the errors? Maybe apache and the modules have to be compiled together (correct versions)
03:10:59 <last1> these are all packages..
03:11:51 <Kalten> Something in /var/log/messages ?
03:17:42 <Kalten> you did load all those kernel modules and after that `service apache24 restart` or the like? (normaly in /boot/loader.conf some `modulename_load="YES"` for future boots)
03:18:40 <last1> I think apache 24 is hosed after upgrading to 13.1
03:20:54 <Kalten> What does “to be hosed” mean?
03:22:22 <last1> ok, so I am trying to start it, it says: /usr/local/etc/rc.d/apache24: WARNING: failed to start apache24
03:22:44 <last1> httpd-error log just says: AH00016: Configuration Failed
03:22:55 <Kalten> and /var/log/messages or /var/log/www*-error.log or the like?
03:24:20 <last1> figured it out, it was a certificate error
03:24:23 <last1> had to use truss to figure it out
03:24:49 <Kalten> I did not want to send you into truss :-)
03:26:30 <last1> thanks :)
03:27:36 <Kalten> I didn't help much ;-)
03:28:22 <Kalten> Ui! I should go to bed (it is 4:28 in the morning at my place)
03:29:11 <LXGHTNXNG> Kalten: screwed, broken
03:30:04 <Kalten> LXGHTNXNG: “hosed” = that? ah! thank you
03:30:12 <LXGHTNXNG> yis.
03:30:48 <mweya> Yo, we're in the same timezone kalten! :D
03:31:06 <Kalten> Austria, and you?
03:31:14 <mweya> Bayern :D
03:31:35 <Kalten> Dann a guate Nocht!
03:31:48 <mweya> Wunsche ich dir ebenfalls! :D
03:32:10 <Kalten> :-)
03:59:01 <parv> ( 'Word is "hosed"; synonym is "screwed" or "broken".' 'Could you use that in a sentence?' 'parv hosed "/" when the destination path variable was not correctly set during "rsync --delete-after -r ...".' )
04:00:02 * LXGHTNXNG turns into a giant cube
09:35:10 <vxwarlock> How can I perform eSIM activation on freebsd ?
09:35:41 <vxwarlock> [console]
09:54:26 <vxwarlock> thinkpad t14 wwan module Quectel EM05-G  > How can I do eSIM activation?
11:13:17 <grahamperrin> V_PauAmma_V or anyone else who subscribes to the freebsd-test list: please, did you receive either of the messages that were sent this morning?
11:14:37 <grahamperrin> One at 09:51, another at 10:27, it's now 11:13, <https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-test/2022-November/> does not yet exist.
12:27:28 <yuripv> grahamperrin: they are there now (an hour later :D)
12:28:25 <yuripv> (i wonder why anyone would *subscribe* to that list though)
12:29:40 <grahamperrin> yuripv: five tests were sent, the first two (09:51 and 10:27) are missing from <https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-test/2022-November/index.html>.
12:29:41 <VimDiesel> Title: test⊙Fo
12:30:37 <yuripv> html-only ones? (i guess that's what you are testing?)
12:31:40 <grahamperrin> No.
12:36:15 <Fergorn> hello
12:36:41 <Fergorn> i use sway (wayland tiling wm) and pipewire on linux, do those work in freebsd?
12:37:09 <grahamperrin> Less of a concern: of the three that are visibly archived, two were not delivered to me.
12:53:31 <meka> Fergorn: I tried sway and it works and I know pipewire is in packages, but I don't know how well it works
12:53:55 <meka> I use oss, jack and pulseaudio on daily basis
12:59:05 <Fergorn> meka so basically i am using linux for the past 10 year exclusively as desktop/laptop
12:59:40 <meka> Me from 2006 :o)
12:59:45 <Fergorn> but i dislike where the ecosystem is going in general, was thinking of freebsd. and i want to use sway and pipewire for a good desktop experience
13:00:20 <Fergorn> also i want access to dev tools, like compilers etc, for java etc. but some other tools like docker too
13:01:05 <Fergorn> whats holding me back is that it seems linux has got the bigger part of the pie in support for software and hardware
13:01:45 <Fergorn> thats why i am looking to find what works and what doesn't
13:02:25 <Fergorn> meka also i am used to a rolling release model. in freebsd the system updates in set intervals of few months and the rest of 3rd party apps are rolling right?
13:02:34 <Fergorn> also do you install freebsd-current for desktop?
13:03:23 <meka> You're right about base/packages and you probably should set "latest" instead of "quarterly" for package repository if you want more frequent updates of packages
13:03:57 <meka> I run current only when I have to. For example, this laptop doesn't have all drivers in 13.1, so I keep compiling 14-CURRENT on it
13:04:13 <Fergorn> yes i want my system to be rolling release and the base system to be as close to up to date without breaking
13:04:29 <Fergorn> is current unstable?
13:05:40 <meka> Fergorn: depends on the definition of "stable" but yeah, that's where the errors happen and get fixed
13:05:55 <meka> So, being vibrant, it will ocasionally break
13:05:59 <Fergorn> ok so system should be stable and packages latest
13:06:17 <meka> But I use bectl to save current system boot environment before I update
13:06:50 <meka> It's something like saving a snapshot of VM, so if update did something noughty you can revert
13:07:15 <Fergorn> ok i see. also do you mix binary packages with ports?
13:07:45 <Fergorn> i am currently using gentoo and custom building everything. not sure what i should do in freebsd, if everything should be from ports
13:29:29 <vxwarlock> Can anyone run ax211 for 13.1 stable?
13:31:45 <meka> Fergorn: if you want ports and packages, it's better to build ports with poudriere and set it up as local repository
13:32:05 <meka> But you can ping me when you get to that if it's too hard
13:34:48 <Fergorn> meka ok thanks
13:35:02 <Fergorn> also are the packages build with the maximum number of options?
13:35:11 <Fergorn> if i take the binaries
13:37:39 <xmj> package builds enable only the default options
13:51:54 <Fergorn> xmj are the default options enough or you usually have to custom build from ports
13:55:10 <ASHER> hello i have a problem i try install something and i get it undefined reference to `libintl_gettext' and before it i install the gettext someone know?
13:55:11 <xmj> they're fine
14:09:19 <ASHER> someone?
14:30:06 <satanist> ASHER: you might want to give some details about what do you want to install, how do you try to install it and at which command you get the error
14:37:38 <grahamperrin> ASHER: also (the usual, with IRC) be patient for people to reply
14:52:17 <ASHER> yes but in freebsd 11.4 is to be working now when i have freebsd 12 is have a problem
14:52:28 <ASHER> i try run x3 services
14:52:35 <ASHER> and i get error
14:53:02 <ASHER> undefined reference to `libintl_gettext' and before i install gettext
14:55:01 <ASHER> devel/gettext (gettext-0.21)  (unknown build error)
15:03:27 <bellhyve> Ports or packages? When I upgrade I sometimes get into a weird dependency issues, but it's usually because I forgot to run something like "pkg-static upgrade -f". The major release change means you need to reinstall/rebuild everything.
15:04:06 <ASHER> pack
15:04:10 <bellhyve> https://docs.freebsd.org/en/books/handbook/cutting-edge/#freebsdupdate-portsrebuild
15:04:11 <VimDiesel> Title: Chapter 25. Updating and Upgrading FreeBSD | FreeBSD Documentation Portal
15:06:29 <bellhyve> This usually fixes it for me. Maybe just to be safe, change your shell to on in /usr/bin. I think I got locked out a couple times over the years when I used to use bash and hit build dependency issues after upgrade.
15:13:41 <ASHER> ok thanks
16:49:33 <vxwarlock> Anyone using ax211 on freebsd 13.1?
16:50:16 <cpet> good luck
16:50:30 <vxwarlock> thanks a lot ;)
16:51:05 <vxwarlock> it crashes nonstop. if I use it  iwlwifi
18:02:27 <spacefrog> why do i get a warning that i should upgrade from 12.3 when 12.4 isn't even out yet'?
18:05:13 <cpet> in theory the latest version is 12.4-RCX
18:05:17 <johnjaye> depends, where is the warning from? maybe the issue is fixed there
18:08:28 <spacefrog> it as on a fresh vm just as I ran freebsd-update
18:08:40 <spacefrog> i should have captured the whole message, sorry
18:08:45 <spacefrog> is 12 going to be EOL soon?
18:08:57 <cpet> 12.3.is
18:09:35 <spacefrog> if i deploy something on 12 that depends on say php7, how long before i have to upgrade to 13 which ships with php8?
18:09:38 <cpet> https://www.freebsd.org/security/
18:09:39 <VimDiesel> Title: FreeBSD Security Information | The FreeBSD Project
18:10:06 <spacefrog> thanks
18:10:10 <spacefrog> that answers my q
18:10:25 <cpet> also 13.1 has php74
18:11:02 <spacefrog> that's good to know, i really appreciate it
18:11:15 <cpet> https://www.php.net/
18:11:16 <VimDiesel> Title: PHP: Hypertext Preprocessor
18:11:50 <cpet> https://www.php.net/supported-versions
18:11:52 <VimDiesel> Title: PHP: Supported Versions
18:12:17 <spacefrog> i'm going to test against FBSD13 and php7.4
18:12:21 <cpet> and it EOL's in 15 days :D
18:12:23 <johnjaye> spacefrog: are you talking about the fact the eol of 12 is in 2023?
18:12:30 <spacefrog> johnjaye: yes
18:13:00 <johnjaye> oh ok. yeah bsd standard is 5 years after major releases, 3 months after point releases
18:13:15 <spacefrog> yeah, i as just reading that
18:13:20 <spacefrog> so 13 it is
18:13:27 <cpet> spacefrog, I worked for a IT company that still had 6.3 production servers
18:13:32 <cpet> spacefrog, so heh
18:13:35 <spacefrog> lol
18:13:57 <spacefrog> i'm dealing with a client stuck on CentOS 6 with PHP 5.3
18:14:04 <johnjaye> by the way you're using freebsd in a vm right? am i crazy or is there no interpreters like python by default?
18:14:08 <spacefrog> the dev is spinning ubuntu but i'm not a fan
18:14:26 <cpet> johnjaye, ports
18:14:34 <spacefrog> yes, vm
18:14:45 <spacefrog> no need for metal unless you're doing ML/AI
18:14:52 <spacefrog> at least i see no reason to go metal
18:14:57 <johnjaye> it's funny you mention centos. i saw a talk from a conference by a php dev where he said php had a reputation for putting out breaking changes too much. so redhat stopped updating past php5 for years
18:15:15 <spacefrog> they did
18:15:23 <cpet> reminds me of Enlightenment
18:15:38 <spacefrog> RHEL7 which was a bit late to the market compared to prev releases, shipped with 5.4
18:15:41 <mictty> cpet: wut?
18:16:02 <mictty> cpet: what is Englightenment, cpet
18:16:21 <spacefrog> it's a crappy desktop clone of Ubuntu or Arch i bet
18:16:34 <spacefrog> i recall the UI looking all fancy about 15 years ago
18:16:35 <cpet> mictty, window manager
18:16:44 <spacefrog> isn't there a distro as well?
18:16:49 <spacefrog> with the same nam
18:16:49 <johnjaye> spacefrog: by the way i get an error on a freebsd 12 vm about installing pkg. it says txz non-recovable resolver failure
18:16:56 <cpet> well its not really a distro but a WM
18:17:10 <spacefrog> johnjaye: i run it on vmware, no issues
18:17:16 <cpet> https://www.enlightenment.org/
18:17:17 <VimDiesel> Title: Enlightenment Main
18:17:26 <cpet> or x11-wm/enlightenment
18:17:26 <johnjaye> ok. thanks
18:17:36 <spacefrog> i've ran freebsd at home for fun on virtbualbox with the same rate of success as on vmware
18:17:56 <cpet> need to reinstall my freebsd bhyve vm
18:18:02 <cpet> for some reason it doesnt boot any more
18:18:10 <yuripv> spacefrog: you must be thinking about elementary
18:18:16 <spacefrog> yuripv: that must be it
18:19:09 <yuripv> johnjaye: just set up your network (/etc/resolv.conf)?
18:19:31 <cpet> that is for DNS resolving not really for "network"
18:21:03 <johnjaye> well i'll mess with it later. i just went to the online bsd to test it
18:21:39 <spacefrog> i was thinking of asking these people to pay RH <400$/year to get RHEL but on second thought, that money can go towards hardware upgrades
18:21:48 <V_PauAmma_V> grahamperrin, I don't think I'm subscribed to it.
18:25:14 <spacefrog> anybody running FBSD on xcp-ng?
18:25:27 <spacefrog> i want to hear some feedback if possible
18:29:47 <mictty> I have my cheap knockoff of parallels vm, I named plurals.
18:30:12 <mictty> I put it in my resume and sent it to Parallels and ignored. It reminds me.
18:38:36 <mictty> is the performance of bhyve way above kvm so more to compare with VMware?
18:39:28 <mictty> I don't really do bench by myself, but information out there seems not so consistent
18:41:36 <debdrup> That's because benchmarking hypervisors isn't really very useful.
18:42:39 <debdrup> Individual components can be benmarked (and sometimes are, although usually it's not done correctly).
18:43:06 <debdrup> The BUGS section in the diskinfo(8) manual page is very relevant here :)
18:45:12 <debdrup> Where benchmarks are useful is where you have a specific workload in mind, and you yourself know how to create a repeatable test that can simulate that workload.
18:45:55 <debdrup> Only _then_ can we start talking about the benchmark itself, visa vi average/mean/median values, standard deviations, confidence levels, et cetera ad nauseum.
18:52:24 <mictty> debdrup: specific guest or specific guest's specific workload?
19:00:01 <mictty> debdrup: benchmarking is an helluva labor
19:05:21 <cpet> hrm just realize vm configure freebsd is a thing
19:05:24 <cpet> hah
21:33:36 <Fudge> hey guys, returning to freebsd after many years. am a blind user, typically got stuck in debian/ubuntu for last 12 years as it offered support for me in the console.
21:34:24 <koobs> Fudge: welcome back
21:35:02 <Fudge> koobs:  thanks so much, there is a guy who has developped a console screen reader and when i requested he extended support to freebsd as well.
21:35:13 <koobs> Fudge: nice :) whats the software?
21:35:24 <Fudge> donno about you guys but I find it difficult or restrictive only haveing access to a DE
21:35:32 <Fudge> it's called Fenrir
21:35:39 <Fudge> python based
21:35:42 <koobs> ive never run a FreeBSD DE, so :)
21:35:54 <Fudge> legend :D
21:35:55 <koobs> Fudge: yep
21:36:00 <koobs> its in my browser history from last week
21:36:13 <Fudge> very interesting, what took you there
21:36:20 <koobs> trying to remember
21:36:46 <Fudge> Chrys is a German dev, think he software develops during the day.
21:36:58 <Fudge> if i remember right that is lol
21:38:05 <koobs> mmm cant remember why/hgow i ended up knowing about fenriur
21:38:07 <koobs> but it was recent
21:38:26 <Fudge> so ive spun up my 11.1 vm I got help to make, just upgraded to 11.4 and about to go to 12.1. ill see if i can get the speech working as ive had difficulty in the past with the keyboard driver. Then move it to my real install. if it works well im going to swap out my main server to it from debian.
21:38:51 <koobs> Fudge: nice :)
21:38:53 <koobs> source upgrades
21:39:25 <Fudge> anyway wont hog the channel, thank you for being so welcoming koobs. ill try not to ask too many questions prior to browsing handbook to catch back up ahahahah
21:39:49 <koobs> Fudge: pleasure. let me know when youre ready for fenrir and we'll prototype a port for it
21:40:22 <koobs> dependencies look fairly simple (and most/all are in ports already)
21:40:45 <Fudge> that would be amaing thank you, it's hard when you get stuck on setting it up because my showstopper is the keyboard driver and if you lose capability well you know.
21:40:59 <koobs> *nods* understood
22:15:47 <parv> Fudge, Thanks for mentiong "fenrir"; have been on the lookout for similar software for eventual use
22:16:32 <Fudge> parv:  im very good with screenreaders, just not getting fenrir working on freebsd lol
22:16:42 <Fudge> feel free to ask anything if i can be of help
22:18:02 <Kalten> parv: that one? https://github.com/chrys87/fenrir
22:18:04 <VimDiesel> Title: GitHub - chrys87/fenrir: An TTY screenreader for Linux.
22:18:33 <koobs> parv: happy to help you set a port going (or python install testing support)
22:18:45 <parv> Fudge, Could I talk to you in private or the -offtopic channel?
22:18:55 <Fudge> yeah parv  absolutely feel free to pm me
22:19:03 <parv> What is "freebsd-offtopic" channel, with "#" or "##"?
22:21:35 <mason> parv: #freebsd-social
22:21:51 <parv> mason, Thank you
22:50:37 * parv realizes the mistake of searching for "offtopic" instead of "off-topic" at https://wiki.freebsd.org/IRC/Channels
22:55:27 <parv> koobs, I will be happy to test/try "fenrir"
22:56:39 <parv> Kalten, Yes, seems like (I found about "fenrir" here just recently)
22:56:48 <koobs> parv: nice. you lead ill help :)
22:57:25 <Kalten> parv: good
22:57:30 <parv> koobs, Sure, point me to the port 😎
22:57:37 <koobs> haha
22:58:19 <koobs> first test/poc: install virtualenvwrapper, create a virtualenv, tthen pip install it into the venv and test
23:52:01 <parv> Are 'linux/input.h' and 'linux/input-event-codes.h' available on FreeBSD 13 (errors:  https://termbin.com/x5dp ) ? Or, is there another way to compilve Python evdev ( https://pypi.org/simple/evdev/ )? Perhaps need to check The Ports ...
23:52:02 <VimDiesel> Title: Links for evdev
23:54:07 <Kalten>  /whois parv
23:56:22 <Kalten> I think, that---at least had been---a problem with the bamboo graphic tablet from wacom in order to be able to use it as more than just a mouse.
23:57:06 <Kalten> (years ago: no idea, whether it works by now)
23:58:17 <Kalten> x11-drivers/xf86-input-wacom or by now may be x11/libwacom
23:59:16 <Kalten> I have not looked into that for a loooong time (pressure sensitivity and absolute coordinates were quite nice for photo editing)