00:21:26 <koobs> morning
00:26:05 <thumbs> morning koobs
00:26:23 <koobs> thumbs: how are you ?
00:27:17 <thumbs> koobs: been up for 48 hours ish
00:27:25 <koobs> ergh
00:27:27 <koobs> why
00:27:42 <thumbs> because I have to fix other folks mistakes
00:27:49 <koobs> *hugops*
00:28:03 <koobs> hope youre getting at least $quadrupletime
00:28:06 <thumbs> I technically had a 10 minutes power nap
00:28:16 <thumbs> (I still feel terrible)
00:28:24 <koobs> even that can help
00:28:36 <koobs> but, likely less productive staying up, than sleeping
00:28:46 <koobs> after 16~ hours brain is dead
00:29:03 <koobs> services down or less severity?
00:29:19 <thumbs> oh, multiple services down
00:29:22 <koobs> ergh
00:29:29 <koobs> noone to tapout?
00:29:52 <thumbs> nah, no one cares to learn this hardware to fix it
00:29:57 <koobs> erigh
00:30:22 <thumbs> anyway, going to crash in about 1-2 hours
00:30:32 <koobs> enjoy mate
03:35:19 <darwin> will FreeBSD UNIX 13.1 fit on a DVD or I need DVD-dl? (if you don't call it UNIX, that's fine, but as a college/university freshman, official latest stable release documentation still said so)
03:44:15 <rtprio> quite a lot less than a dvd
03:45:27 <darwin> well ls says 4.6GB for the DVD, and my DVDs say 4.7... occasionally I've had stuff that close that because of the format, didn't actually fit
03:48:51 <rtprio> only if you want to needlessly download a bunch of packages you won't use
03:49:01 <rtprio> compare to the size of memstick.img
03:51:52 <darwin> i have that but am asking about the DVD ISO
03:53:06 <rtprio> i don't see why they'd make a dvd image that couldn't not fit on a dvd
03:54:16 <rtprio> you don't need the extra packages, you can just use -disc1.iso.. or bootonly for that matter
04:01:13 <darwin> because there's DVD-dl (8.5GB); I'm only asking about the DVD ISO
04:02:03 <darwin> seems my FreeBSD 13 is on DVD-dl but I haven't made another 13.1 one yet (but want to make a rewritable one)
04:08:01 <rtprio> what dvd-dl? https://download.freebsd.org/releases/amd64/amd64/ISO-IMAGES/13.1/
04:08:02 <VimDiesel> Title: Index of /releases/amd64/amd64/ISO-IMAGES/13.1/
04:09:43 <rtprio> you could have had it burned by already. aren't burnable media less than a buck each?
04:10:40 <rennj> yee old 8cent 3.5" floppy cost you $2 bucks chuck!
04:11:15 <mason> Using USB seems a lot less wasteful nowadays, since they can be re-used many times.
04:11:28 <rtprio> i have done a floppy disc install of freebsd before; i wouldn't recommend it
04:11:53 <mason> In fact... darwin: a netbooted install would be even less resource-intensive.
04:12:00 <rtprio> mason: like, i haven't burned a cd or dvd for like 10 yaers
04:12:50 <mason> I burned one a year or two ago for a foolish SuperMicro firmware update.
04:15:38 <mason> Ah, he left, just when I'd found the pxeboot section of the handbook.
04:26:03 <rennj> pxe how primitive, why not ipxe
04:27:22 <rennj> http://boot.salstar.sk/
04:27:23 <VimDiesel> Title: Index of /
04:27:57 <mason> rennj: It seems dangerously modern. I'm still used to arp/rarp/tftp
04:28:22 <rennj> no doubt
04:28:28 <rennj> it is moderm
04:28:30 <rennj> it is modern
04:31:04 <rennj> https://github.com/rackerlabs/boot.rackspace.com/blob/master/src/freebsd.ipxe
04:31:05 <VimDiesel> Title: boot.rackspace.com/freebsd.ipxe at master · rackerlabs/boot.rackspace.com · GitHub
04:31:25 <rennj> old
04:36:08 <rennj> https://www.freshports.org/net/ipxe/ hmm thats modern
04:36:10 <VimDiesel> Title: FreshPorts -- net/ipxe: Open source network boot firmware
04:37:02 <rennj> Last Update: 2022-09-07 21:58:51
04:37:42 <rennj> solaris jumpstart server ftw..course you had to have it on like local lan segment..
04:38:10 <rennj> rarp/arp past router most likely
04:40:43 <rennj> all i want it to know how to power on 72U rack and bring up 72boxen with as minimal headache as possible, https://maas.io/ foobar
04:40:44 <VimDiesel> Title: MAAS | Metal as a Service
04:42:10 <rennj> https://www.tidalscale.com/ even better and supposedly they use freebsd/bhyve
04:42:13 <VimDiesel> Title: TidalScale – Data Center Reliability, Availability, and Serviceability (RAS)
04:43:27 <rennj> https://www.theregister.com/2017/08/18/tidalscale_is_software_defining_servers/
04:43:28 <VimDiesel> Title: Software definer wants you to befriend the 'BFC', do a bit of 'reverse virtualization' • The Register
04:44:08 <rennj> Instead of running multiple virtual machines in a single physical server it creates a single virtual machine made up from multiple physical servers and their resources linked with a 10GbitE network.
04:44:25 <rennj> hmm 0 down...
04:49:44 <rennj> https://www.yahoo.com/now/tidalscale-announces-availability-software-defined-130000723.html sexy
04:49:45 <VimDiesel> Title: TidalScale Announces Availability of Software-Defined Server Technology in AWS Marketplace
06:22:05 <meena> mason: you're very welcome
08:42:45 <adilix> hi all
09:52:41 <mage> very funny, it's already the third "zfs replication" tool that I'm evaluating which doesn't guaranteed atomicity across snapshots
09:55:35 <mage> a restore of a PostgreSQL installation could be even more "funny" if WAL are stored on a separate dataset (:
11:39:04 <polyex> anyone try https://www.tidalscale.com/?
11:44:14 <polyex> rennj where you find out tidalscale uses fbsd/bhyve?
11:45:34 <rennj> https://blocksandfiles.com/2022/08/17/tidalscale-and-inverted-server-virtualization/
11:45:35 <VimDiesel> Title: TidalScale and inverted server virtualization – Blocks and Files
11:45:43 <rennj> but i recall reading it years ago
11:45:52 <rennj> perhaps was in youtube video
12:03:10 <polyex> ever use it? it actually work?
12:13:07 <meena> polyex: they claim to have some big customers, so, who knows?? maybe!?
12:17:17 <polyex> pricing is secret so it must work !!
12:31:27 <meena> love when pricing is secret
13:41:38 <rennj> polyex, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OpenSSI not a new concept
13:41:39 <VimDiesel> Title: OpenSSI - Wikipedia
13:42:48 <rennj> back to those sweet tandem nonstop systems
13:43:19 <polyex> wow based on linux
13:43:26 <polyex> shoulda used freebsd
13:45:17 <rennj> it was ported to linux
13:45:23 <rennj> was on unixware/sco
13:45:46 <rennj> and hp killed it most likely..cause it seems dead
13:48:05 <jgh> FT systems are *hard*.  And expensive because of that.  I used to work on one, some while back (not Tandem)
13:50:14 * nacelle saw a Netra FT 1800 in real life for a few years
13:50:37 <jgh> that was mine
13:53:00 <jgh> and a couple of predecessors
14:17:52 <meena> " When SCO stopped selling NonStop Clusters, the former Locus team, now working for Compaq (which had acquired Tandem in the interim), ported the NonStop Clusters code to Linux and released it as open source." that's a lot of complicated words in one sentence
14:44:46 <Delemas> I've got a Freebsd 12.3 stable system with an i3-8100 using onboard video. It has both a full sized display port (DP) and HDMI ports for video display. On other OSes such as Linux HDMI works fine but on Freebsd only DP displays. I get a no signal when I attempt to use HDMI on Freebsd 12.3 until I switch to a DP cable and a temporary monitor. Is there some what to get HDMI working?
14:46:56 <Delemas> I meant, is there some way I can get the HDMI display working? Sadly the monitor I need doesn't have a display port input and finding a DP to HDMI cable that actually works if challenging...
14:46:57 <polyex> jgh what's FT?
14:47:59 <meka> Delemas: if you're using Xorg, you can try arandr (GUI for xrandr)
14:48:37 <Delemas> I so can't type today... That should have been is challenging. No I'm talking about the basic text console not displaying. X is N/A.
14:49:18 <Remilia> Delemas: a verified good DP-to-HDMI adaptor is the Dell thing, supports 4K@60 too iirc https://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/dell-adapter-displayport-to-hdmi-20-4k/apd/492-bbxu/pc-accessories
14:49:19 <VimDiesel> Title: Dell Adapter - DisplayPort to HDMI 2.0 (4K) | Dell USA
14:49:31 <Remilia> I have one
14:50:51 <jgh> polyex: Fault-Tolerant.    Bits of hardware can break, but the system carries on running... and can accept replacements
14:51:24 <polyex> ty
14:53:47 <Delemas> hmm well that's one solution if I can't solve the software issue. Is there no way to coax Freebsd to use HDMI for text console?
15:10:05 <Remilia> am afraid I have never dealt with this myself, so hopefully someone more knowledgeable will respond
15:12:54 <tsoome_> text console as VGA text? it is set up by BIOS.
15:13:31 <tsoome_> so, if the BIOS setup does not help...
15:17:01 <Remilia> tsoome_: I have not seen a BIOS that would let you choose onboard video output between HDMI and DP so far, usually the GPU determines where to send video
15:17:26 <Remilia> and it seems BIOS output goes to the right output
15:18:07 <Remilia> unless Delemas forgot to mention that there is no signal over HDMI even in BIOS
15:23:55 <Delemas> That's a good point. I haven't tried the BIOS with HDMI recently. I will double check the next time I can bring the system down, likely this evening. I know text consoles in Linux worked on HDMI. I moved from a Linux VM host running a freedbsd VM to directly running it on the hardware hence the current difficulties.
15:25:06 <Delemas> I'm fairly confident the BIOS works over HDMI but let's check to be sure...
16:00:51 <polyex> windows and linux now bringing rust in. will freebsd fall even more behind?
16:01:31 <PredatorONormies> polyex, what do you mean 'fall even more behind'? The reason I left Linux is that it started introducing Rust and shit
16:01:41 <mason> Adopting fads isn't necessarily the same thing as moving forward.
16:01:53 <polyex> popular == fad? lol
16:02:08 <polyex> rust is objectively a better lang that makes better software
16:02:19 <PredatorONormies> polyex, I disagree.
16:02:21 <polyex> im starting to learn it now and it's obvious
16:02:32 <PredatorONormies> I got a big list of reasons
16:02:39 <polyex> main 2?
16:02:40 <mason> Use it for a few years and see if it's still obvious.
16:02:45 <PredatorONormies> polyex, then it's obvious you know nothing about programming/hacking lol
16:02:53 <PredatorONormies> polyex, there is no main 2
16:03:02 <polyex> k so gimme a couple
16:03:12 <PredatorONormies> is there some pastebin? I don't want to get kicked in my hole for "spamming"
16:03:54 <polyex> cat file.txt | nc termbin.com 9999
16:05:08 <mason> Anyway, being able to generate better software isn't a shoe-in for anything. If it was we'd all be writing in Lisp and Erlang.
16:09:55 <polyex> PredatorONormies?
16:17:59 <Delemas> Old DP to HDMI cable I had ended up working. Thanks for the help.
16:27:31 <rtprio> things like 'oom-killer' and 'systemd' make me think that linux is falling behind.
16:28:03 <Tikosh> what is going on? how you're all doing?
16:28:10 <polyex> ya me too but you dont have to run those
16:29:11 <PredatorONormies> https://termbin.com/rzfb
16:29:11 <PredatorONormies> polyex,
16:29:12 <polyex> when fbsd decided to ignore desktop and be a "server OS" i knew it was bad. that was true. learning rust, im telling you rn, freebsd will be left behind again and this time terminally. freebsd finally dead? no, but effectively yes. it's already fringe
16:30:13 <PredatorONormies> Not being popular != being dead
16:30:29 <Tikosh> I'm a gentoo linux user and am curios about FreeBSD myself
16:30:29 <PredatorONormies> If anything is popular - it's actually shit. That's unfortunately how many things work in life
16:30:37 <rtprio> and remember most people are volenteers, they're going to work on what thy want to work on
16:30:53 <PredatorONormies> Because many people don't give enough shit to investigate - so they are given shit software and other shit
16:30:59 <PredatorONormies> they wouldn't know a difference because they don't caer
16:31:23 <Tikosh> Does anyone know how to get the rtw89 wifi driver to work on FreeBSD?
16:32:52 <rtprio> Tikosh: it's not in a released version of freebsd, yet
16:32:58 <steew> You should switch to current and hope for the best
16:34:20 <rtprio> https://wiki.freebsd.org/WiFi/Rtw89
16:34:21 <VimDiesel> Title: WiFi/Rtw89 - FreeBSD Wiki
16:34:27 <PredatorONormies> Yeah - I think I regret not using current.. I'm on the fucking OpenZFS FILESYSTEM
16:34:44 <PredatorONormies> (not sure if that is bulletproof)
16:35:07 <rtprio> PredatorONormies: i've used current for years; why do you regret not being on current? do you have a realtek wifi card too?
16:35:23 <PredatorONormies> Nope
16:35:27 <PredatorONormies> I'm guessing updates
16:35:32 <PredatorONormies> I miss my Arch GNU/Linux era
16:35:36 <PredatorONormies> on OpenZFS
16:35:44 <PredatorONormies> A pain worth the glory
16:35:57 <rtprio> what updates are you trying to receive?
16:36:02 <Tikosh> is there a way for a FreeBSD novice to get involved, even thought he is a gnu/linux simp?
16:36:11 <PredatorONormies> rtprio, good quesiton - I wouldn't know
16:36:25 <PredatorONormies> By the way do ports get updated on current?
16:36:31 <PredatorONormies> I'd like if one could update ports
16:36:36 <PredatorONormies> And then compile again
16:36:54 <steew> ports are always updated if you just track them via git
16:36:59 <rtprio> PredatorONormies: no ports are updated continously.
16:37:31 <rtprio> Tikosh: you would need to run current and enable the driver in the build.
16:39:28 <PredatorONormies> steew, 0.o but I don't see a git repostiory in /usr/ports
16:39:31 <PredatorONormies> only a .gitgnore
16:40:08 <PredatorONormies> The FreeBSD Ports Collection is maintained in several branches, which
16:40:08 <PredatorONormies>      differ mostly by versions of software provided: the head branch contains
16:40:08 <PredatorONormies>      all the latest changes, while the quarterly branches only provide
16:40:08 <PredatorONormies>      critical fixes.  The head branch can be installed or updated from the
16:40:08 <PredatorONormies>      Subversion repository located at:
16:40:09 <PredatorONormies>      https://svn.FreeBSD.org/ports/head
16:40:10 <VimDiesel> Title: ports - Revision 569609: /head
16:40:10 <PredatorONormies> This?
16:40:24 <rtprio> PredatorONormies: you would need to remove it and fetch it fresh; https://forums.freebsd.org/threads/guide-using-git-to-manage-ports-source-and-documentation.79721/
16:40:25 <VimDiesel> Title: [Guide] Using Git to manage ports, source and documentation. | The FreeBSD Forums
16:40:27 <steew> if you enabled the ports checkbox in the installer gui then they are just tracked with portsnap
16:40:40 <steew> you should remove that directory and git clone the ports tree there
16:40:54 <PredatorONormies> could one use svn instead of Git, like the manual is recommending (I  guess)?
16:41:08 <steew> as far as Im concerned, svn has been deprecated in favour of git
16:41:11 <rtprio> no, don't use subversion; https://wiki.freebsd.org/Ports/GitQuickStart
16:41:13 <VimDiesel> Title: Ports/GitQuickStart - FreeBSD Wiki
16:41:15 <PredatorONormies> Lol really?
16:41:24 <PredatorONormies> Git is bloated hell
16:41:37 <rtprio> and subversion is not very good
16:41:40 <PredatorONormies> One needs to go to Git school to learn it
16:41:40 <steew> not if you install git-tiny
16:41:50 <rtprio> there's also `gitup`
16:43:08 <PredatorONormies> meh
16:43:25 <Tikosh> are ports like similar to git? and that support on all latest BSDs?
16:43:34 <PredatorONormies> Anyways - thanks
16:43:54 <rtprio> ports are text files that tell the system how to build packages
16:44:09 <Tikosh> oh! like similar to like gentoo then
16:44:11 <rtprio> and ports are only for freebsd; other bsds have their own schemes
16:44:17 <Tikosh> okay
16:44:36 <Tikosh> I currently run Gentoo and curious about FreeBSD
16:44:46 <Tikosh> i just downloaded 13.1
16:44:50 <PredatorONormies> Buy another computer
16:44:51 <PredatorONormies> XD
16:44:57 <Tikosh> hahahahahahah yea
16:45:05 <PredatorONormies> What? That's what I do
16:45:08 <PredatorONormies> Computers are easy
16:45:09 <Tikosh> I run a L14 thinkpad
16:45:09 <PredatorONormies> for testing
16:45:14 <PredatorONormies> Lol IME
16:45:58 <steew> Yeah, I also used to run gentoo, migrated to freebsd and started building everything from ports (with Synth). I got tired and now i just use binaries
16:46:40 <PredatorONormies> I want to compile shit myself more (but dont?)
16:46:48 <PredatorONormies> Because I believe that's how computers are supposed to work
16:46:49 <rtprio> PredatorONormies: you do you, man
16:46:49 <PredatorONormies> 0 binaries
16:46:58 <PredatorONormies> Okay
16:47:08 <Tikosh> steew, okay. is there a wiki that points to ports? i'm curious
16:47:27 <PredatorONormies> https://freebsd.org
16:47:28 <VimDiesel> Title: The FreeBSD Project
16:47:34 <Tikosh> PredatorONormies, Try it out. I konw gentoo is fun.
16:47:35 <PredatorONormies> Somewhere on there I think
16:47:40 <Tikosh> alright
16:47:42 <PredatorONormies> Tikosh, Yeah - I heard
16:47:48 <steew> https://docs.freebsd.org/en/books/handbook/ports/#ports-using
16:47:49 <VimDiesel> Title: Chapter 4. Installing Applications: Packages and Ports | FreeBSD Documentation Portal
16:48:00 <PredatorONormies> I guess I don't feel comfortable about it yet..-
16:48:02 <Tikosh> I'll do admit. I run a binary of firefox on my gentoo build
16:48:07 <PredatorONormies> I got used to comfort again (bad)
16:48:20 <PredatorONormies> I could delete Firefox right now
16:48:25 <Tikosh> PredatorONormies, It's good to pick your battles
16:48:35 <PredatorONormies> It's tempting
16:48:38 <PredatorONormies> Yeah
16:49:51 <Tikosh> I gotta xmonad.hs file that i can wgetpaste to share. wanna see it?
16:51:00 <steew> I think you should redirect this to #freebsd-social or start a direct message
16:51:11 <Tikosh> understood
16:51:26 <Demosthenex> i moved from gentoo to freebsd. my systemd free low maintenance dream has come true.
16:51:39 <Demosthenex> zfs on gentoo was dodgy and fragile as hell
16:51:43 <Demosthenex> so tyty freebsd =]
16:51:49 <PredatorONormies> :)
16:52:05 <PredatorONormies> > <Demosthenex> zfs on gentoo was dodgy and fragile as hell < I did it on Arch GNU/Linux - half the documentation didn't work
16:52:15 <PredatorONormies> Either that or I was seriously demented XD
16:52:15 <Tikosh> Demosthenex, i bet. I do admit I run systemd on my gentoo build, 'cause i want to use DisplayLink
16:52:40 <PredatorONormies> I was SURE that the docs got changed like a day after I successfully got it installed (but without encryption)
16:52:54 <PredatorONormies> Wtf is DisplayLink?
16:53:17 <Demosthenex> i was booting root on zfs on gentoo, so i could do portage updates in snapshots. was a shitstorm. i had pages of notes on updating, and it consistently broke. now i "bectl -a $date ; bectl chroot $date ; freebsd update ; bectl activate $date ; reboot"
16:53:19 <Tikosh> PredatorONormies, it is a driver that enables multi-monitors through usb
16:53:37 <Demosthenex> no idea why systemd would be required for usb monitors
16:53:39 <Demosthenex> i used to run 3
16:53:48 <PredatorONormies> bectl?
16:53:52 <Tikosh> Demosthenex, me either
16:53:56 <Demosthenex> boot environment controller
16:53:57 <PredatorONormies> lol
16:54:04 <PredatorONormies> USB monitors? whoah
16:54:04 <Demosthenex> it's zfs root management
16:54:18 <PredatorONormies> Demosthenex, lol I never used anything alike it
16:54:25 <Demosthenex> and it's all built-in as a first class feature in freebsd.
16:54:30 <PredatorONormies> The utmost I used was/is sanoid for snapshot management
16:54:32 <Tikosh> PredatorONormies, well, I use a plugable usb dock that connect to usb type c
16:54:40 <PredatorONormies> IT IS WHAT
16:55:03 <Demosthenex> heck, i setup my laptop on a 1tb hdd w/ zfs, and once i was happy, i threw it in another computer booted from usb, and the zfs sent my whole drive to my laptop with the SSD installed. seamless migration
16:55:29 <mason> PredatorONormies: I still use Subversion. It's fine. Most of the software we use today was developed using Subversion or Git.
16:55:50 <Demosthenex> i can zfs send my whole laptop, OS and data, to my fileserver. if i have to restore my drive, i boot usb, and zfs recv. restored
16:55:59 <Tikosh> Demosthenex, i got a 2tb nvme ssd with 32 gb of ram 'cause i'm crazy
16:56:09 <Tikosh> running on a ryzen 3 pro cpu
16:56:19 <Tikosh> all those threads are great for gentoo
16:57:15 <Demosthenex> so, compile for days instead of weeks?
16:57:25 <Demosthenex> freebsd binaries for core OS is perfect.
16:57:29 <Tikosh> no, just hours
16:57:52 <Tikosh> Demosthenex, to install a new system takes me 4 hours
16:57:56 <Demosthenex> even most pkgs i don't bother with compiling, and i love that /usr/local is for all the addons.
16:58:20 <Tikosh> Demosthenex, yea. I use a firefox binary on mines
16:58:59 <Demosthenex> when i moved from gentoo to freebsd, i had fewer issues than last time i distro hopped from ubuntu to gentoo.
16:59:01 <PredatorONormies> > <Demosthenex> heck, i setup my laptop on a 1tb hdd w/ zfs, and once i was happy, i threw it in another computer booted from usb, and the zfs sent my whole drive to my laptop with the SSD installed. seamless migration < You're shitting me
16:59:04 <Demosthenex> it was nearly seamless.
16:59:05 <PredatorONormies> So basically a drive clone?
16:59:14 <Demosthenex> PredatorONormies: yep
16:59:19 <PredatorONormies> o.o
16:59:22 <PredatorONormies> noice
16:59:29 <PredatorONormies> I guess
16:59:30 <PredatorONormies> not sure
16:59:32 <Demosthenex> it even kept all my 15 minute/hourly/daily snapshots
16:59:51 <PredatorONormies> That might come in-handy,but not for me, I guess
17:00:44 <Tikosh> To get my gentoo build to compile package faster, I put in a line on my make.conf with EMERGE_DEFAULT_OPS= -j8 -l8
17:01:01 <Tikosh> using all 8 threads
17:01:17 <Tikosh> but setting that up, you need some good amount of ram
17:01:33 <Tikosh> just in case
17:01:35 <PredatorONormies> 1G of RAM is enough
17:01:39 <PredatorONormies> 2G of RAM plenty
17:01:43 <PredatorONormies> 4GB asta lavista
17:01:48 <PredatorONormies> 8GB too much
17:01:54 <PredatorONormies> 16GB you're wasting money
17:02:00 <Tikosh> PredatorONormies, i run 32gb 'cause I'm crazy
17:02:02 <PredatorONormies> 32GB you're wasting hardware
17:02:07 <PredatorONormies> yes, you are
17:02:14 <PredatorONormies> I got so much RAM I don't know what do with it
17:02:19 <PredatorONormies> I got so much CPU I don't know what do with it
17:02:22 <PredatorONormies> I got so much GPU I don't know what do with it
17:02:26 <PredatorONormies> Lol sorry for spam
17:02:40 <Tikosh> PredatorONormies, thats okay, just build your OS from source
17:03:03 <Tikosh> of course, you don't need 32 gb of ram to build from source
17:03:03 <PredatorONormies> I kind-of want to
17:03:14 <PredatorONormies> But also - I'd rather do other things
17:03:23 <Tikosh> PredatorONormies, you do you man
17:03:39 <Tikosh> i understand
17:05:06 <PredatorONormies> Nice chat
17:05:41 <Tikosh> PredatorONormies, absouletly! glad to chat with you guys and dudettes
17:05:51 <Tikosh> :)
17:06:50 <PredatorONormies> > dudettes < YO STEALING MA JOKU!
17:07:07 <Tikosh> How does one prefer their cornflakes? with, or without the sugar
17:07:21 <Tikosh> wait, that is a user!?!?!?!
17:07:29 <Tikosh> i meant ladies and gents
17:07:44 <Tikosh> i mean you all
17:07:45 <PredatorONormies> I am no gentleman
17:07:48 <Demosthenex> i'm happy i have yet to find a good reason to compile any part of core freebsd.
17:07:50 <PredatorONormies> Nor a lady
17:07:58 <Demosthenex> the only pkg i compile is emacs, to disable -gtk
17:08:12 <Demosthenex> i shouldn't have to compile from scratch to have a minimal secure os.
17:08:13 <PredatorONormies> Demosthenex, it's always a good reason to compile your software if you can .. and you learn stuff, maybe
17:08:17 <Tikosh> Demosthenex, you run qt?
17:08:22 <PredatorONormies> lol
17:08:52 <Demosthenex> Tikosh: no. emacs has a bug where it crashes with x11 forwarding in gtk. so i revert to the base x11 toolkit (lucid?)
17:09:20 <Tikosh> Demosthenex, oh. okay. i did not knew that. when I do use emacs, i run Doom.
17:09:32 <Tikosh> Domm emacs, for clarification
17:09:36 <Tikosh> not the game
17:09:40 <Demosthenex> PredatorONormies: i've done linux from scratch, i coded something like portage before i found gentoo, i ran gentoo for a decade, i have experience on all major linux distros, and i now run freebsd for my daily driver.
17:09:56 <Demosthenex> so i know all about hand compiling. thats why i avoid it.
17:10:17 <PredatorONormies> Nice
17:10:22 <Tikosh> Demosthenex, okay. I never used LFS and closest I got is gentoo
17:10:24 <PredatorONormies> Oh XD
17:10:26 <PredatorONormies> I do not
17:10:42 <Tikosh> of course, LFS does NOT compart to gentoo
17:10:44 <PredatorONormies> I guess to each their own, but I like the idea of not trusting the binary :/
17:10:52 <Tikosh> LFS is for gigachads
17:11:01 <Tikosh> PredatorONormies, yea
17:12:30 <Tikosh> I am the fitest gentoo user out there. I healthy 600 pounds and daily walks of 2 minutes a day
17:12:30 <PredatorONormies> LFS?
17:12:42 <Tikosh> LFS means Linux from scratch
17:12:58 <PredatorONormies> oh
17:13:00 <Tikosh> but in all seriousness. I do need to lose allot of weight
17:13:15 <PredatorONormies> BFS is for wtfchads
17:13:17 <PredatorONormies> xD
17:13:34 <Tikosh> hahahahahahha
17:13:45 <Tikosh> BSD from scratch
17:13:46 <Tikosh> nixe
17:13:50 <Tikosh> nece
17:13:54 <Tikosh> nice.
17:14:54 <Tikosh> if LFS users are Gigachads, then Bfs users are seraphins
17:15:01 <Tikosh> get it?
17:15:20 <PredatorONormies> nixi
17:15:25 <PredatorONormies> seraphines?
17:15:26 <PredatorONormies> Not really
17:15:28 <PredatorONormies> what are those
17:15:51 <Tikosh> seraphims are a type of angel
17:15:56 <Tikosh> or i gues, daemon
17:16:11 <Tikosh> look up seraphims
17:16:16 <PredatorONormies> o.o
17:16:21 <PredatorONormies> daemon
17:16:23 <PredatorONormies> lol
17:16:27 <PredatorONormies> good joke
17:16:39 <Tikosh> hahahaha thanks
17:16:48 <PredatorONormies> gotta go have code
17:16:58 <Tikosh> seraphims are scary looking
17:17:05 <Demosthenex> so, consider using the #freebsd-social channel for idle chatter ;]
17:17:08 <PredatorONormies> o.o
17:17:13 <PredatorONormies> Yeah
17:17:20 <Demosthenex> but if you have freebsd questions from a gentoo perspective, ask away
17:17:27 <Tikosh> got you.
17:17:42 <Demosthenex> like i said, i converted and it's been fantastic.
17:18:22 <Tikosh> alright. wish me luck install FreeBSD!
17:18:30 <Tikosh> thanks so much for the help!
19:10:29 <bcarson> anyone know who runs forums.freebsd.org? i can't access it from my home IP, but can from elsewhere. it seems like i'm blocked for some reason
20:08:37 <debdrup> wcarson: forum-admins@ cf. https://www.freebsd.org/administration/#t-forum-admins
20:08:38 <VimDiesel> Title: FreeBSD Project Administration and Management | The FreeBSD Project
20:12:22 <wcarson> ah cool, thank you. e-mail sent
20:40:01 <bsdbandit> good evening quick question is there a mingw-w64 package for freebsd ?
20:48:07 <dkeav> doesn't appear so
21:09:55 <meena> can someone explain to me what the difference is between hwaddr and ether?
21:12:49 <meena> there's no mention of hwaddr in ifconfig(8)
21:16:40 <dclau> MAC address
21:19:35 <dclau> both, there's no difference
21:24:33 <bqv> https://upload.xa0.uk:5281/upload/2ZZdqU9-JNBCjuHpDPE65DYS/20220919_115228599_328e..jpg
21:24:33 <bqv> Not that it matters, im resigned to just use bhyve now, but anyone know why this happens?
21:28:10 <meena> dclau: I got some ifconfig pastes that have both
21:35:41 <V_PauAmma_V> If the interface uses the factory-set MAC, only ether. Otherwise, both. https://docs.freebsd.org/en/books/handbook/advanced-networking/#_configuration_examples example 3 is my laptop, and ifconfig re0 has "ether b8:ee:65:5b:32:59" and "hwaddr 28:d2:44:85:f2:03" lines.
21:35:42 <VimDiesel> Title: Chapter 32. Advanced Networking | FreeBSD Documentation Portal
21:37:02 <meena> V_PauAmma_V: i reckon the interface is reachable on both, but which one does the interface communicate with, by default?
21:39:28 <V_PauAmma_V> With falover mode, first in the list. So re0 ethernet here.
21:39:45 <V_PauAmma_V> s/falover/failover/
21:40:40 <meena> V_PauAmma_V: sorry, i was talking about mac addresses (hwaddr vs ether)
21:51:38 <V_PauAmma_V> I think only ether then? Not sure.
22:04:51 <meena> aye.
22:05:21 <meena> how can i tell if an interface is "physical" (including virtio in this definition)
22:10:30 <meena> it seems to be the one that doesn't belong to any groups.
22:12:24 <meena> has hw addr, media type saying something sensible, and has no groups: is physical ✅
22:48:10 <polyex> i gotta restart local_unbound pretty often to get dns resolution working again. how can i debug it?
22:56:00 <meena> polyex: caching issue, or something else? what logging have you enabled to figure it out?
22:58:07 <polyex> what would a caching issue look like? what logging options do i have?
23:00:24 <bqv> Guess not